PDA

View Full Version : obsession over music and taking it too seriously...


Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:05 PM
This something that's been bothering me.

Music is for entertainment and enjoyment. It seems some people use it to define their lives and them as a person, including a few individuals on these message boards. Is that a healthy use for a product OF us and created BY us as humans, meant by definition to be a leisurely pastime of sorts, to CONTROL us and how we think? Some people truly let it define them as a person; hanging on every lyric, trying to find a deeper meaning behind this music they listen to as "soundtrack" of their lives. In this pattern I've seen, the next step is when they get "elitist" with their music. These people think they are above us normal mainstream listeners because they are ORIGINAL and elite and underground. They get extremely protective of the artists producing the albums they're in to and the songs on the albums themselves. Soon they become knowledgable and able to answer every single possible trivia question you could ask them about this music of theirs. Nothing mainstream or on the radio will meet their "standards" anymore. Nothing is "cool" or "hard" enough.

So how can people like that enjoy the music they listen to anymore? The obsession becomes so overwhelming, it becomes a religion - so to speak. How can anyone enjoy something they are always fighting for, because in that sense they are waging their own imaginary war against anything that is not what they listen to and is not by their "approved" artists and/or label(s). The irony is thus: They are really being controlled by it even more than those whom they look down upon are by maintream MTV (VH1 etc), and radio. In the end, it doesn't matter what kind of music it is or by whom its played... it's how these people take it to heart and live by it. It's called OBSESSION, people. :) lighten up.

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 10:12 PM
not all music is for entertainment or enjoyment.
some is a motivational tool. or meant to spread information.
to set a mood. or any number of other reasons.


if it wasn't for art, life would be unbearable.
if we're not supposed to take art seriously... then what's left to take seriously?

Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:21 PM
I guess what I said really hit home then, eh KANEDA? lol :)

I disagree with you wholeheartedly. Music was created for enjoyment and entertainment... to ADD to our lives as human beings, not to control them. Yes, it can motivate; yes, it can inform; and yes, it can set a mood... but even if it does those things, above all of those it ENTERTAINS. Plus, notice all the things you mentioned are POSITIVE and productive things. What I'm talking about is not a positive thing. Obsession is negative. One can take art seriously, but only to a certain degree. It can be abused and one can begin to take it TOO seriously. That's what I'm talking about here.... or did you completely miss my point? ;)

BlueLady
04-28-2003, 10:25 PM
I entirly agree with you Miyu!! Listen to what you love and enjoy it!! I can't stand people who will buy anything from a certain group just to have it wherther it's good or not. I mean there are groups/people I love but I won't turn them into my personal god.

On a side note, where you been Miyu??? You have been missed ; )

Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:28 PM
I don't post here alot anymore. lol

*hug for bloo*

ravensquee
04-28-2003, 10:29 PM
Hahaha... XD

Laura, didn't you like, a weekish ago post lyrics in your livejournal saying something like, "oh wow, this song totally describes me and my life" and what not??
Music is art, it's another form of self expression, and that people do take rather seriously at times. Like painting, or y'know, something else like that. It's not just a "leisurely pasttime of sorts", it can be more than that. Everything is always far more than it seems; you should know that.

And what are you talking about "their own imaginary war against anything that is not what they listen to and is not by their 'approved' artists and/or labels"?? People like things and they don't like other things. It's simple. Nobody can be expected to like everything, including music. As Dave says, "Some people do and, some people don't; but that's okay - that's just the way it should be." Hahaha... XD

And those people whom you speak of, these, "elitist" underground music fans: at least they're diggin' on music that THEY like, not the music that MTV and other ginormous corporations are telling them that they should all like. Way to not conform, guys! *thumbs up*

And yeah, I could probably go on since music is tre' important to me, but I shall cease my arguments here for now. Whee!

ravensquee
04-28-2003, 10:32 PM
Lol. Hmmm... Groovy signature lyrics, laaaaura.

final testament
04-28-2003, 10:34 PM
I agree with that wholeheartedly. Some people just take music among other things, WAAAAAYYY to seriously!

I mean damn, some people revolve their lives around things like music. Weather it be "underground" hip-hop or whatever. They let the music they listen to define who they are.

I just think that's wrong.

People themselves should define who they are, not let some outside force do it for them. (music, religion etc.)

I know tons of people like this. It's a sad thing to see in my opinion.

Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:35 PM
I posted some lyrics I RELATED to. It had a line about men not respecting women who speak their minds. What I'm saying here is completely different, Sarah. ^_- That's pretty obvious.

everyone is conforming to something. that's a constant in life whether or not its mainstream.

ravensquee
04-28-2003, 10:39 PM
"everyone is conformng to something. that's a constant in life whether or not its mainstream"

Well then there ya go. Why are you complaining if you already know and understand this??

Michi
04-28-2003, 10:44 PM
She's complaining because others don't get it. ^_^;

Though this might fit better in the Rant Board. :F

Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:45 PM
Music is art, it's another form of self expression, and that people do take rather seriously at times. Like painting, or y'know, something else like that. It's not just a "leisurely pasttime of sorts", it can be more than that. Everything is always far more than it seems; you should know that.

there is always a limit to a healthy admiration for art and music and the people who create it. you should know that as well. some people (and we have both met them) take it to an extreme.


And what are you talking about "their own imaginary war against anything that is not what they listen to and is not by their 'approved' artists and/or labels"?? People like things and they don't like other things. It's simple. Nobody can be expected to like everything, including music. As Dave says, "Some people do and, some people don't; but that's okay - that's just the way it should be." Hahaha... XD

you're missing the point entirely. i'm aware peoples' tastes differ. i'm saying that some of these fans are telling other straight out "oh that music is empty and souless" etc etc because it doesn't meet their "standards". I, myself, don't like some of the music you listen to and vice-versa, but it we don't hate on eachother for it. :) we both also keep open minds about new artists and songs... they people I'm posting about don't.

And those people whom you speak of, these, "elitist" underground music fans: at least they're diggin' on music that THEY like, not the music that MTV and other ginormous corporations are telling them that they should all like. Way to not conform, guys! *thumbs up*


i'm not talking about them, i was using that genre of music as an example of what the hypothetical obsessee's in my post would deem "cool". When I say "elitist" i'm NOT using it in a positive "admirable" sense of the word... I'm using it to describe close-mindedness.

And yeah, I could probably go on since music is tre' important to me, but I shall cease my arguments here for now. Whee!

the point you made was a good one, but i think you kind of missed my point. :\

ravensquee
04-28-2003, 10:55 PM
Missed your point?? Eh, can't win 'em all I s'pose. Lol.

But really, I think that this thread of yours is nothing more than a personal attack upon somebody, and y'know what?? That's definitly not cool, and you need to stop your little self-proclaimed war against someone who hasn't done anything to deserve this.

RyuHayabusaDOA2
04-28-2003, 10:56 PM
Miyu-sama!*glomps* well, I added a comment on your LJ and I added you to my friends list as well.

back on topic:
well, when you hit puberty and you're going through the changes, music can really affect you on how you feel and you feel that the songs reflect of what you are going through. But after that, you make the choice if it affects you wholeheartly.

I don't know if this sounds right or not, but here is one thing to consider: whether be anime, cosplay and everything else, must be taken in moderation. There I said it... if that moderation is not there, anything can be turned into an obession and I agree with Miyu there.

Tenshi
04-28-2003, 10:57 PM
I know exactly what you mean. Because I used to be one of those people you're describing.

When I reached high school, I started taking the music I listened to WAY too seriously. **flashback** OHMIGOD, it's being played on the Top 40 station! It sucks now! Trendy sucks! It's all mindless! Only these few bands are okay! **/flashback**

And you know what happened. . .music stopped being a hobby, something that I loved. It became a chore, a liability. It wasn't fun any more.

And if music isn't fun and enjoyable, then what's the point? Music doesn't have to blatantly shove a point in your face to be meaningful. It just has to make you feel.

Thanks for this topic. I liked writing this ^_^.

Miyu
04-28-2003, 10:58 PM
uhm, this thread was inspired by pricks on LJ Communities who rant about how much ALL music that isn't THEIR music sucks, actually. O_o ....but thanks for making that lovely assumption. LOL

you know how much time i've spend browsing LJ lately. it's obscene :P

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:00 PM
I just think it's ridiculous that you fuck with me any chance you get. It's getting old.


did Basquiat, Pollock, or Picasso take art TOO seriosuly?
did Kurt Cobain, Jim Morrisson, or Ian Curtis take art too seriously?


i still stand behind my statement that music isn't just for entertainment. take AUBE's album "Pages From The Book" it's manipulated sounds of him tearing pages from the Bible.
entertaining, not really. stimulating, yes.
or his albums of brainwaves turned into sound.

and music's main goal is to alter mood and stimulate the mind though frequencies.
push the mids and highs to work the people up into a frenzy.


Its not like music was created by one person for one reason.
ANYONE can do ANYTHING with music for ANY reason.

music was banned in Khomeini's Iran on the grounds that it stimulates the brain. We've done him one better in the land of Coke and honey... using music to people's brains to sleep.
Ever wonder why commercial radio's so bad? It's 'cause someone upstairs wants it that way.

if the Doors or John Lennon were getting started now... the industry wouldn't sign 'em in a million years.

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:04 PM
...although I shoudn't expect people are aren't musicians to automatically understand.

I guess living with passion for something and putting your all into it is a crime around here....

ravensquee
04-28-2003, 11:05 PM
Well it's a crime to those who are close minded and can't think outside of the box.

RyuHayabusaDOA2
04-28-2003, 11:06 PM
well, isn't living with Passion for Cosplay the same thing? Oh well..you can't please everybody most of the time Kaneda.
again. it's moderation. that's the key word.

BlueLady
04-28-2003, 11:09 PM
thank you!!! 90% of the time trendy does suck.. but sometimes it's fun. It is funny to see the avril/blink182/ whatever's new cults roaming the mall though.

This darned LJ thing...gonna destroy the world.. mutters....

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by RyuHayabusaDOA2
well, isn't living with Passion for Cosplay the same thing? Oh well..you can't please everybody most of the time Kaneda.
again. it's moderation. that's the key word.

...well I never said anything against cosplay...
so....... yeeeah...

moderation is ...hmmm.. more for the confused-as-to-what-to-do people....

I've dedicated myself to music and art.

Viral Harvest
04-28-2003, 11:11 PM
Music can be a positive influence as well as a negative influence. There's good and bad of everything. Music will mean something different to different people and this whole topic is completely opinion. Whether you want to listen to "underground" or "mainstream" music is entirely up to you. There's no facts to be proven here.

You can't judge every single person who's in the underground scene as well as people who aren't. Some people let it control their lives, some people let it define their lives, and others don't. That's just how it is. I listen to what's good to me. I grew up with underground punk and hardcore though so what do you expect? I've been into the same scene for a good 7 years.

I'm not really much of an "elitist" as you say, because who's fucking right really is it to judge other people based on what they listen to? Complete crap if you ask me. Are we really stooping that low as a race to judge people based on what music they listen to? Wow, why not judge people based on what television shows they watch too? Yes, that sounds like a bloody good plan to me!

Life is too short for this shit, seriously, christ. People need to form their own ideas and beliefs and stop relying on someone else's experiences to get through their own hardships. Influence is fine, influence is what builds new ideas and realizations, but when you're leeching onto concrete thoughts that aren't yours, that's when you start to become a slave to the tangible.

Hey, I gotta say though, the scene I'm a part of pretty much saved me from alot of drug use and crime I could have continued with. This is the scene I choose to be a part of, because it's more a community than anything, and really, what's the harm in that? I'm not letting it control my life in any way, it's something I'm proud to be a part of and that's solely my decision. I'm interacting with people who've been through the same shit I have and it's the best choice I've ever made in my entire life.

But hey, to each his/her own, I'm not going to jump down anyone's throat because they're not into what I'm into. I have friends from many different groups, I'm not going to hate someone for who and what they are, (because that's just silly) but rather for what their character is. People will do what they need to do to stay content and sometimes make others content, and that's pretty much what life's all about. Music is a vent and an escape, it's no different than writing, drawing, or any other positive vent someone might have...

Nuff' said.

Miyu
04-28-2003, 11:12 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
I just think it's ridiculous that you fuck with me any chance you get. It's getting old.


did Basquiat, Pollock, or Picasso take art TOO seriosuly?
did Kurt Cobain, Jim Morrisson, or Ian Curtis take art too seriously?


i still stand behind my statement that music isn't just for entertainment. take AUBE's album "Pages From The Book" it's manipulated sounds of him tearing pages from the Bible.
entertaining, not really. stimulating, yes.
or his albums of brainwaves turned into sound.

and music's main goal is to alter mood and stimulate the mind though frequencies.
push the mids and highs to work the people up into a frenzy.


Its not like music was created by one person for one reason.
ANYONE can do ANYTHING with music for ANY reason.

music was banned in Khomeini's Iran on the grounds that it stimulates the brain. We've done him one better in the land of Coke and honey... using music to people's brains to sleep.
Ever wonder why commercial radio's so bad? It's 'cause someone upstairs wants it that way.

if the Doors or John Lennon were getting started now... the industry wouldn't sign 'em in a million years.


I think it's ridiculous that you have the arrogance to assume this topic was meant to "fuck with you". It's a pretty broad topic of discussion, don't you think? O_O rofl ....wooow you like music so this topic must be about you. UHM NO.

and all I can say about all the shit you just posted is this: PROOF that people take music and the music industry WAY too fucking seriously! Jesus! O___O no wonder so many artists kill themselves.. the pressure their fans put on them is enormous.

This is just me personally, but once things come to that level of obsessin, they just aren't enjoyable to me anymore.

Miyu
04-28-2003, 11:17 PM
Originally posted by Viral Harvest
Music can be a positive influence as well as a negative influence. There's good and bad of everything. Music will mean something different to different people and this whole topic is completely opinion. Whether you want to listen to "underground" or "mainstream" music is entirely up to you. There's no facts to be proven here.

You can't judge every single person who's in the underground scene as well as people who aren't. Some people let it control their lives, some people let it define their lives, and others don't. That's just how it is. I listen to what's good to me. I grew up with underground punk and hardcore though so what do you expect? I've been into the same scene for a good 7 years.

I'm not really much of an "elitist" as you say, because who's fucking right really is it to judge other people based on what they listen to? Complete crap if you ask me. Are we really stooping that low as a race to judge people based on what music they listen to? Wow, why not judge people based on what television shows they watch too? Yes, that sounds like a bloody good plan to me!

Life is too short for this shit, seriously, christ. People need to form their own ideas and beliefs and stop relying on someone else's experiences to get through their own hardships. Influence is fine, influence is what builds new ideas and realizations, but when you're leeching onto concrete thoughts that aren't yours, that's when you start to become a slave to the tangible.

Hey, I gotta say though, the scene I'm a part of pretty much saved me from alot of drug use and crime I could have continued with. This is the scene I choose to be a part of, because it's more a community than anything, and really, what's the harm in that? I'm not letting it control my life in any way, it's something I'm proud to be a part of and that's solely my decision. I'm interacting with people who've been through the same shit I have and it's the best choice I've ever made in my entire life.

But hey, to each his/her own, I'm not going to jump down anyone's throat because they're not into what I'm into. I have friends from many different groups, I'm not going to hate someone for who and what they are, (because that's just silly) but rather for what their character is. People will do what they need to do to stay content and sometimes make others content, and that's pretty much what life's all about. Music is a vent and an escape, it's no different than writing, drawing, or any other positive vent someone might have...

Nuff' said.


AFUCKINMEN. :D

You know what really gets me is that people don't realize that the roles can reverse too - people who listen to ANY genre of music can become the way i describe in my original post... not just those into "underground" stuff.

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:25 PM
too seriously based on what and WHO's standards?
and WHY standards anyways?

and.. those artists... I seriously doubt ANY of them killed themselves because of fan-pressure. Life lived is what gets to more artists than anything having to do with the fans....
it's about personal standards and boundries.


I haven't really encountered many people (in here especially) that understand the truly subversive though.

BlueLady
04-28-2003, 11:39 PM
um cause its a cosplay board not really a music one???

Miyu
04-28-2003, 11:39 PM
I'm sorry Chris, but you've really been sounding egotistical lately with this better-than-you attitude you display to people regarding art and music. You weren't that way when I met you. I wonder what changed you? :\ It's not very becomming.

anyways back on topic:

Psychologically speaking it is unhealthy to become consumed with anything past a certain degree. It could be anything.... but in this case we are talking about music, obviously. I would consider that to be a preeeeetty broad topic.

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by BlueLady
um cause its a cosplay board not really a music one???


subversity has little to do with any one thing.
it's not just music or art... it's anything.
and that includes COSPLAY as well!!

RyuHayabusaDOA2
04-28-2003, 11:45 PM
*wants to say something, but the only word I can come up in my mind is moderation, so I leave this thread*

KANEDA
04-28-2003, 11:46 PM
Originally posted by Miyu
I'm sorry Chris, but you've really been sounding egotistical lately with this better-than-you attitude you display to people regarding art and music. You weren't that way when I met you. I wonder what changed you? :\ It's not very becomming.



ditto.

Miyu
04-28-2003, 11:53 PM
aw feel the hate. *^^*

well we've established that despite what your ego may tell you, this topic is not about KANEDA, but music and the people who take fandom to an extreme.

MOVING ON...

It's one thing, I think, to write articles about music and write reviews and such for a magazine as a job, but I'm browsing through LJ and seeing paragraph-upon-paragraph of this crap. These fans are battling it out! Just because one person doesn't have the same tastes in music as another person, animosity brews. That just can't be healthy.

BlueLady
04-28-2003, 11:57 PM
hmmm maybe its time for me to start a LJ and cause some problems...eh heh heh.... Brittany is the greatest snger out there right...LOL

XLainoftheWired
04-29-2003, 12:06 AM
Hey, guys, I just baked a fresh batch of oatmeal-raisin cookies!!! Let's all eat them over a nce game of monopoly. Then, when we finish that we can watch "Tommy", ok? Sorry if my post is totally unrelated, like it is, but I hope you all can be friends again. Cause I don't want to have to see Kaneda on the weekends and Miyu during school days.

hmmm... Tommy was a good movie.

::noticing my avatar, I hope its cute enough to prevent me from getting beat up too bad in here... braces self::

Katse
04-29-2003, 12:31 AM
One person's passion is another's obsession, one person's moderation is another's ignorance. That's art. How deep one is affected by it, or how important it is to one's self-expression cannot be generalized by any standardized form.

Art simply doesn't exist for our own self-expression--in fact, the concept of self-expression is relatively new. Music may very well be the oldest form of art expressed by humans--a time before we painted cave walls or carved idols. The first patterns of nature were copied down in music--the rhythms of heartbeats and drums, the songs of birds. Music is the only art we are born with an innate ability to create and recreate with our personal instrument, our voice.

Post modernists say that history is dead, and because history is dead, so is art. When you listen to the radio, watch the TV, it is obvious that it is no longer the people who are deciding what becomes a hit and what doesn't. It is all in the hands of those who have money, who have power. It is a form of controlling those of us who prefer to be lead and do not wish to lead. Being different than the stereotypical average (as determined by those in power, once again)--does that make you crazy? Are you suddenly another Charles Manson? Or are you elitist? Are you some ossified opera fan who wouldn't know John Lennon from a VW Beetle?

Whatever turns your crank, I say. Fandom extremes are wonderful until they injure someone. Can music alone make someone kill another person? Or kill themselves? It depends on more than just what the person listens to on their CD player late at night.

And speaking as an artistic type, moderation is never an option. You either go the whole way, or you don't go at all.

Katse

Velvy
04-29-2003, 12:48 AM
*lightning streaks the sky, angels descend, the ground quakes, and a bright light fills the room*

Okay maybe not ^_^

But Miyu, you deserve a choir of "halelujiah"s!

The one thing that almost always ticks me off above all other things is: People who stop liking a band, because...it went mainstream.

I believe this rather fits with the topic at hand. Whatever happened to liking music because it was simply pleasing to our ears? It seems I get my "neck stood on" more and more for listening to artists with "no artistry", "no soul", the "Fake lesbians" t.A.T.u., the "terribly unoriginal nu-metal" Evanescence, the "TRL'er" Jewel, "manufactured" Madonna, "so not punk" Linkin Park, "she can't sing for shit" Vanessa Carlton, and so on...

Well excuse me, I didn't know a set of qualifications apply for such music artists.

I'm glad I've flipped and done the 180, and am now happily listening to whatever I want without riddling myself with nonsense such as, "Oh, this is poppy stuff, can't listen to it"

On a somewhat related note, my attire has come into play with certain ppl:

XD I can't even wear a tie, without that little someone saying, "Trying to be like Avril eh?" Question: Why the fuck do you care if I wear a tie or not? Apparantly this constitutes a devotion to Avril Lavigne? *squeezes your cheeks* Grow up. :D

khamryn
04-29-2003, 10:13 AM
I think some of you are completely missing Miyu's point, too determined to think she's out to get you to think about anything else. I'm specifically talking about KANEDA. She is not out to get you, she's posting about something that interests her that she wants to see discussion about. Is that wrong?

So... let's get back on topic and stop pointing fingers/being paranoid. ::End OT post.::

Babbit_Chan
04-29-2003, 12:25 PM
*skips all the heated discussion* I'm guessing, but are you talking about the fans, Miyu? If so, I completely agree with you. Music is meant to complement our lives, not take over it.

As for KANEDA, I don't think he's completely wrong either. Music CAN be used for other purposes. The music is out there for anyone to interpret and put to use. And you're right - healthy, passionate dedication is NOT a bad thing. I think Miyu's original topic was that there are overly-obssessed, blind fans. That's all.

.. Did that make sense :( *quietly sneaks away*

Kurenai
04-29-2003, 12:56 PM
Passion and music DO go together....sometimes.

Music is a lot like literature. You have books with depth that can make you feel and think, and books that don't HAVE anything to say but are purely for entertainment.

A lot of English teachers make their living on finding meaning in books that students think aren't meant to have any meaning beyond what they clearly state. It's all a matter of perspective.

What's the point of hating someone for finding something beautiful in a book that's not considered a "classic"?

It's exactly the same with music, which is just a different outlet. Why not just listen to something for the sake of listening to music? If it changes your life, great, if it doesn't, maybe you should stop searching so hard and enjoy it.

final testament
04-29-2003, 01:23 PM
Originally posted by BlueLady
um cause its a cosplay board not really a music one???


HAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! Thank you Captain Obvious! HAHAHHHHA

Damn, you made him look stupid!

God, don't you just love pointing out the BLATANTLY obvious to people Bluelady. I do!

You Raawwkkk!

Miyu
04-29-2003, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by Babbit_Chan
*skips all the heated discussion* I'm guessing, but are you talking about the fans, Miyu? If so, I completely agree with you. Music is meant to complement our lives, not take over it.

As for KANEDA, I don't think he's completely wrong either. Music CAN be used for other purposes. The music is out there for anyone to interpret and put to use. And you're right - healthy, passionate dedication is NOT a bad thing. I think Miyu's original topic was that there are overly-obssessed, blind fans. That's all.

.. Did that make sense :( *quietly sneaks away*


That's exactly what I was trying to target - the overly-obsessed and blind fans that alienate everyone else from the artists/labels that they are consumed with. Thank you for understanding the point I was making! :) That made me happy.

Also.... thank you Kham... you obviously understood the point I was trying to make too. ;)

BlueLady
04-29-2003, 01:26 PM
thank you final testament.. it is one of the few highlights of my day mwa ha ha haaaa

KANEDA
04-29-2003, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by Katse
One person's passion is another's obsession, one person's moderation is another's ignorance. That's art. How deep one is affected by it, or how important it is to one's self-expression cannot be generalized by any standardized form.

Art simply doesn't exist for our own self-expression--in fact, the concept of self-expression is relatively new. Music may very well be the oldest form of art expressed by humans--a time before we painted cave walls or carved idols. The first patterns of nature were copied down in music--the rhythms of heartbeats and drums, the songs of birds. Music is the only art we are born with an innate ability to create and recreate with our personal instrument, our voice.

Post modernists say that history is dead, and because history is dead, so is art. When you listen to the radio, watch the TV, it is obvious that it is no longer the people who are deciding what becomes a hit and what doesn't. It is all in the hands of those who have money, who have power. It is a form of controlling those of us who prefer to be lead and do not wish to lead. Being different than the stereotypical average (as determined by those in power, once again)--does that make you crazy? Are you suddenly another Charles Manson? Or are you elitist? Are you some ossified opera fan who wouldn't know John Lennon from a VW Beetle?

Whatever turns your crank, I say. Fandom extremes are wonderful until they injure someone. Can music alone make someone kill another person? Or kill themselves? It depends on more than just what the person listens to on their CD player late at night.

And speaking as an artistic type, moderation is never an option. You either go the whole way, or you don't go at all.

Katse


exactly. you stated that prefectly.
but see, the non-artistic types will NEVER understand what we're trying to say. 'cause they're not part of anything like it...

and what is amazing to me.... o.k. I'm pretty positive just about no one in here is really a musician or anything. and don't forget; being able to play an instrument and being a musician aren't the same thing.
yet, those of us that ARE ....get treated like we dunno what we're talking about. Amazing.
I mean goddamn, I'm published internationally.
CDs, t-shirts, and fansites!
I would think I know how shit works!

and I've never talked to any musician that said "I make music to entertain people".
..and if a musician DOES say that... their stuff is probably really weak and stupid..and they probably have nothing interesting to say at all.


moderation is NEVER an option.
...and if you think it is, you do NOT understand art and the mind of artists. (graphic artists, writers, poets, musicians, etc...)

Tenjou
04-29-2003, 07:54 PM
In advance, sorry if I get anyone mad, but this is my opinion.

I have to say there is a fine line between "influence" and "obsession". When I think of influence, I think of the Ramones/Misfits/Sex Pistols's music being heard by Green Day and Blink, and now kids my age are listening to them. That is what I think is influence.

Obsession to me is someone that likes (insert band) because they are getting lots of airplay and are now on (popular program)on a regular basis. This person probably has pictures plastered every corner of their room of said band. They must have everything (insert band) or they're not happy.

But as in relation to the topic title, some people can (and will) take it seriously. If a woman from an abusive relationship listened to "Never No More" by Aaliyah, of course they'll relate to it, because it is a serious topic. But if someone just likes X band because of their expectations for music or whatever, I think that is quite silly and will make them blind to any other bands with more talent and/or entertainment value that they will fail to listen to because their expectations are too high.

And if you have expectations, I think it's sorta funny.. I mean, listen to what you like, because if you wait around for the PERFECT band, you'll never be pleased.

Later.
(this wasn't directed at anyone in peticular)

Miyu
04-29-2003, 09:29 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
exactly. you stated that prefectly.
but see, the non-artistic types will NEVER understand what we're trying to say. 'cause they're not part of anything like it...

and what is amazing to me.... o.k. I'm pretty positive just about no one in here is really a musician or anything. and don't forget; being able to play an instrument and being a musician aren't the same thing.
yet, those of us that ARE ....get treated like we dunno what we're talking about. Amazing.
I mean goddamn, I'm published internationally.
CDs, t-shirts, and fansites!
I would think I know how shit works!

and I've never talked to any musician that said "I make music to entertain people".
..and if a musician DOES say that... their stuff is probably really weak and stupid..and they probably have nothing interesting to say at all.


moderation is NEVER an option.
...and if you think it is, you do NOT understand art and the mind of artists. (graphic artists, writers, poets, musicians, etc...)

this is a bit off-topic, but it needs to be said:

so you're saying that myself and the majority of the other posters on this topic are inexperienced with music and making music because we disagree with you? You're calling ME a "non-artistic type?" HAHAHAHA. (Anyone who knows me knows that is EXTREMELY far from the truth; laughably so.)

you had a couple of tracks put onto a small indie compilation that 99.5% of the world has no idea exists. And you talk about yourself as if you were elvis or some shit. I know for a fact that you don't have any "fansites". A few sites that follow the DHR label (which you aren't even technically SIGNED on!) review your work on the compilation and some of your live "shows"... and that's it. Don't front - it's bad for your health. :) you might just get called out on it.

So in retrospect - you've been published on ONE indie CD along with a bunch of other no-namers, and briefly mentioned in some reviews online of said CD. I have never seen YOUR face on any t-shirts chris, and I've never seen these "fansites" you speak of. Care to prove me wrong? ^_-

you're not famous. stop acting as if we should all bow-down to you as the music god and never question you on the subject OF music.

BlueLady
04-29-2003, 09:47 PM
Um Im a payed professional artist and often you have to make art to entertain before they will ever pay attention to the point Im trying to make. Rarely I will listen to music with a point if it's annoying or boring. It's gotta have a catch to appeal to some mass audience if the muscian ever hopes to make it. So many indie people say they are expressing themselves and that's great, but do you hope to make a living if you only have 5 fans?? Styles come and go and I believe as an artist that you have to change and evlove as well. You have to accept the public and non artists as they become your greatest fanbase in reality, and being so angry and stubborn with this god like attitude is only gonna cost you your career in the future, kaneda.

Katse
04-29-2003, 11:03 PM
There is more than just one type of artist. And this time I'm going to be egotistical and say that I'm the expert on this field simply because I've been involved in music, theatre and writing for over ten years. I've worked with people at the top of the ladder and ones that were at the bottom, and everywhere in between and there is definitely a difference.

Some artists enjoy creating, and they enjoy getting paid for it. They want to do it as their livelihood, and many of them know that they can only be so self-expressive if they want to get paid. Many artists do cater to a certain audience. There is no question that the vast majority of artists do that because it's a steady income, steady job, steady, if a bit limiting, creatively speaking.

From that group there are a select few who are prodigies. Who bring something completely amazing and new to what they're already doing and they get noticed for it. They're discovered, and once they're discovered, they have much more flexibility to be themselves and not just deal with fanservicing. But being famous for one thing doesn't guarantee your fans will stick with you through your entire career as you develop artistically. The perfect example of this is Eddie Van Halen--he started out doing a number of covers, was noticed that he had more talent than meets the eye, and he and his band became famous. His fans hung on while he went through two different singers, but by the time he hired Gary Cherone as the third (and in my mind, best lyricist), and released Van Halen III in 1998, the CD was completely panned because it was not the same as what had been released in the past. He had matured creatively and his fans didn't even buy half a million of the CDs. Despite his fame and fan following, he didn't give the fans what they wanted. It cost him--and very few fans really care if Mr. Van Halen thinks it's his best work. And there hasn't been a CD released since.

I have a higher opinion of indie artists than most because they are people that are doing their art simply for the sake of art. They are the true starving artists. They don't want to please anyone else with their art, they don't care if anyone likes it, or if anyone ever sees or hears it. That's the essence of true art, of true self-expression. When you don't care what anyone thinks. I'd rather be an unknown, creating the best damn music I've ever heard, than to be some slave to the masses fad artist.

Katse

KANEDA
04-29-2003, 11:22 PM
Originally posted by BlueLady
Um Im a payed professional artist and often you have to make art to entertain before they will ever pay attention to the point Im trying to make. Rarely I will listen to music with a point if it's annoying or boring. It's gotta have a catch to appeal to some mass audience if the muscian ever hopes to make it. So many indie people say they are expressing themselves and that's great, but do you hope to make a living if you only have 5 fans?? Styles come and go and I believe as an artist that you have to change and evlove as well. You have to accept the public and non artists as they become your greatest fanbase in reality, and being so angry and stubborn with this god like attitude is only gonna cost you your career in the future, kaneda.


who EVER said I gave a shit about money or career?
If I was doing this for $$$, I'd just sell my soul like everyone else and get some Khakis & a tie, and join the business world. be some boring realtor or work for an insurance company.
LOL and by the way... I'd kill myself before I'd do that!

I don't care about fans liking what I do.
I'm glad people DO like it and the CD has sold many thousands of copys worldwide...
but I don't do it FOR people.
I don't cater to the current tastes.

evolve or die.
but also dont mold yourself to be accepted!!

this isn't about "making it"
..that is the wrong attitude for any self-respecting artist to have.

Himemiya
04-30-2003, 12:21 AM
I think I agree with Miyu. Yeah, I agree with her. and i'm sleepy, so thats all im gonna say about that.

Kaneda, I love you. You argue with everyone. But if you want to pretend like you're a god of the music industry because you're "internationally known", lemme spill something out for you.

I sang, and played, in Carnegie Hall, NYC. I was part of a high school Choir that sang at a level above most local college choirs. I can write lyrics at the drop of a hat. I can sing Opera, blues, spirituals, and just about anything you can throw at me. I was part of a college marching band that is invited to Competitions all over the country... not to compete, but just to showcase, because there would be no competition.

But really, none of this really matters. It doesn't make me better than anyone else, it doesn't make me more of an artist than anyone else. It just means I sing and play my baritone. I make music. Big whoop. it doesn't mean i know more than anyone else.

To anyone that thinks they are better than any other musician or artist, step back and take a look at yourself. There is no real way to compare ones musical talent to anyone elses.


And if this post is way off topic or something, please exuse me. i'm sleepy. ^^;

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 04:20 AM
Originally posted by Himemiya
I think I agree with Miyu. Yeah, I agree with her. and i'm sleepy, so thats all im gonna say about that.

Kaneda, I love you. You argue with everyone. But if you want to pretend like you're a god of the music industry because you're "internationally known", lemme spill something out for you.

I sang, and played, in Carnegie Hall, NYC. I was part of a high school Choir that sang at a level above most local college choirs. I can write lyrics at the drop of a hat. I can sing Opera, blues, spirituals, and just about anything you can throw at me. I was part of a college marching band that is invited to Competitions all over the country... not to compete, but just to showcase, because there would be no competition.

But really, none of this really matters. It doesn't make me better than anyone else, it doesn't make me more of an artist than anyone else. It just means I sing and play my baritone. I make music. Big whoop. it doesn't mean i know more than anyone else.

To anyone that thinks they are better than any other musician or artist, step back and take a look at yourself. There is no real way to compare ones musical talent to anyone elses.


And if this post is way off topic or something, please exuse me. i'm sleepy. ^^;


LOL
I don't argue with everyone.
Everyone argues with ME. ^_~

...and I never said I thought I was better than any other artist....
I'm saying non-artists can't criticize well... 'cause they're not a part of it.

but see.. all the choir stuff you did... means you DO know more about THAT genre than people not involved with it. And that is respectible.

Lovelyangel_81
04-30-2003, 07:07 AM
Music is music. Sometimes it can be thought provoking and don't make any sense at all.

I totally agree with you Miyu. Some people just take it too seriously. It's like movies, but that is an whole another story, which I won't go into.

khamryn
04-30-2003, 08:22 AM
>...and I never said I thought I was better than any other artist....

It came across that way. FYI. And its still coming across that way. I played viola for years, was one of the best in my orchestra. I picked up piano very quickly. So if I hadn't, basically your saying I'm not allowed to "criticize"? No. Anyone is allowed to. Anyone is allowed to their own opinions.

BlueLady
04-30-2003, 10:48 AM
hmm personally i like to get paid for what i do so i can support myself. If that means taming down a few peices so be it. After i bring home my nice check from doing a few caracters or whatnot I have plenty of time and money to do my own indie work. There has to be a balence because personally I never see anything as sad as a "struggling artist " with a god complex that stilllives with mommy cause he or she refuses to do anything practical to survive. Come on even Van Gogh and monet did odd jobs and many muscians have done mainstream commercial work under different names to survive. The only people I've met that can say they don't give a fuck about money are the disillusioned, the people with other means of income or the hobbiests. The rest of us call it a living and adapt ( and by the way I've gone to cal arts and art center as well as the showsand studios of many famous artist)

Kurenai
04-30-2003, 10:57 AM
BlueLady has a really good point. No matter how good your work is, it can't be considered a job if it doesn't make you money.

People -don't care- about anyone's precious dreams and ideals -- they want stuff that sells. Because if you're making music only for yourself then it's a hobby no matter how talented you are. And yeah, it sucks that it can be generalized that way, but we all have to deal w/it.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 05:50 PM
Originally posted by khamryn
>...and I never said I thought I was better than any other artist....

It came across that way. FYI. And its still coming across that way. I played viola for years, was one of the best in my orchestra. I picked up piano very quickly. So if I hadn't, basically your saying I'm not allowed to "criticize"? No. Anyone is allowed to. Anyone is allowed to their own opinions.



once again... misunderstood....

if you are from this planet it is your DUTY to judge anyone and anything.

I'm saying what they're doing though is like someone with no legs saying they can play soccer.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by Kurenai
BlueLady has a really good point. No matter how good your work is, it can't be considered a job if it doesn't make you money.

People -don't care- about anyone's precious dreams and ideals -- they want stuff that sells. Because if you're making music only for yourself then it's a hobby no matter how talented you are. And yeah, it sucks that it can be generalized that way, but we all have to deal w/it.


hmmm.. well I never said anything about it being a job.
it can be of course. but I wasn't ever making that point.

and no, if you're making music for yourself.. it's not just a hobby.. or it doesn't HAVE to be. there are thousand of people out there doing their own thing and enough people like it and buy it.

I could spend a whole day making a list of people if you want....

Miyu
04-30-2003, 05:59 PM
but KANEDA, how do you know that everyone on this thread isn't some sort of artistically-inclined prodigy? again, with your assumptions. if you're going to use something to back your arguements, make sure you back them with truths and facts and not petty assumptions... you'll find that doing that will lead to people taking you more seriously. :)

you'll also find you're enormous ego alone cannot carry you through life, and neither can your love for art and music and all that you consider "pure". bluelady is right about that... money will always be a necissary evil. you're a dreamer, you're too idealistic. someday reality is going to give you a swift kick in the face. :D

that's all i have to say for now. you should let us all know when DHR signs you for REAL. ;)

peace. :)

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 06:01 PM
Originally posted by Lovelyangel_81
Music is music. Sometimes it can be thought provoking and don't make any sense at all.

I totally agree with you Miyu. Some people just take it too seriously. It's like movies, but that is an whole another story, which I won't go into.


but here's a question...

"too serious" by who's standards?
they are not living YOUR life and vice versa.
so why does it matter to you?

passion is a crime and people need boundries?
fuck that! eveyone can set their own boundries.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 06:04 PM
Originally posted by Miyu
but KANEDA, how do you know that everyone on this thread isn't some sort of artistically-inclined prodigy? again, with your assumptions. if you're going to use something to back your arguements, make sure you back them with truths and facts and not petty assumptions... you'll find that doing that will lead to people taking you more seriously. :)

you'll also find you're enormous ego alone cannot carry you through life, and neither can your love for art and music and all that you consider "pure". bluelady is right about that... money will always be a necissary evil. you're a dreamer, you're too idealistic. someday reality is going to give you a swift kick in the face. :D

that's all i have to say for now. you should let us all know when DHR signs you for REAL. ;)

peace. :)


LOL
you're one to talk, girl...

and BTW... it was for real from the beginning.
want me to scan the fucking contracts?

but then of course you never even listned to it. real nice.

Miyu
04-30-2003, 06:12 PM
oh c'mon, you can defend yourself better than that chris. :) problem is, you know i'm RIGHT. your arguements here are pointless.

back to the point: there is a certain level that people can reach of obsession that is obvious and annoying and will be noticed by everyone. It's not left up to personal judgement by others; it's to a a certain degree a standard that has been set up psychologically by the human race in its entirety. If you see someone fondeling a tomato and whispering sweet nothing to it - you're going to raise your eyebrow, as that sort of behaviour wouldn't be considered normal by ANY means. It's the same thing I'm talking about here. When you see a young adult who lives in their parents basement and spends all the money they get their hands on paraphenalia, constantly feeding their obsession, and doing nothing but posting to defend themselves and their behaviour in topics like this on the internet all day... you're going to perceive them as being out-of-the-ordinary.

Common sense, KANEDA. Christ.


edit: sure! go ahead and scan the contract, fully intact with your signature at the bottom. :) prove me wrong.

Lil Dreamer
04-30-2003, 06:24 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
but here's a question...

"too serious" by who's standards?
they are not living YOUR life and vice versa.
so why does it matter to you?

passion is a crime and people need boundries?
fuck that! eveyone can set their own boundries.

and yet here u are throwing YOUR standards into all the user's faces on this board and calling them sheep for their tastes and opinions right?? YOUR standards that dictate that anyone who actually enjoys mainstream media is below u. so let me ask u this; why does it matter to YOU to call anyone on here as sheep and blind and as slaves to the machine??

Nipple. :)

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 06:28 PM
Originally posted by Miyu
oh c'mon, you can defend yourself better than that chris. :) problem is, you know i'm RIGHT. your arguements here are pointless.

back to the point: there is a certain level that people can reach of obsession that is obvious and annoying and will be noticed by everyone. It's not left up to personal judgement by others; it's to a a certain degree a standard that has been set up psychologically by the human race in its entirety. If you see someone fondeling a tomato and whispering sweet nothing to it - you're going to raise your eyebrow, as that sort of behaviour wouldn't be considered normal by ANY means. It's the same thing I'm talking about here. When you see a young adult who lives in their parents basement and spends all the money they get their hands on paraphenalia, constantly feeding their obsession, and doing nothing but posting to defend themselves and their behaviour in topics like this on the internet all day... you're going to perceive them as being out-of-the-ordinary.

Common sense, KANEDA. Christ.


edit: sure! go ahead and scan the contract, fully intact with your signature at the bottom. :) prove me wrong.


don't poke the bear in the zoo.
I'm trying to be civil.
but if you won't have that... so be it..

what I think is funny is how your true personal music tastes are near non-existant. just what others around you are into at the monent it seems.

I have a great memory... and I seem to remember a certain date... December 16th... in a thread about favorite bands. and you put ATARI TEENAGE RIOT at the top of the list. ...I don't think you'd ever even heard them.


hhmmmm and that last part... I just love the false-imagery you're putting in people's heads. LOL


just chill out. and call off the dogs.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 06:34 PM
Originally posted by Lil Dreamer
and yet here u are throwing YOUR standards into all the user's faces on this board and calling them sheep for their tastes and opinions right?? YOUR standards that dictate that anyone who actually enjoys mainstream media is below u. so let me ask u this; why does it matter to YOU to call anyone on here as sheep and blind and as slaves to the machine??

Nipple. :)


no, I'm saying destroy the standards and social regulations.


I take it you'e probably not into William S. Burroughs and the like?

Lil Dreamer
04-30-2003, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
no, I'm saying destroy the standards and social regulations.


I take it you'e probably not into William S. Burroughs and the like?

no i'm not.

as far as destroying standards and social regulations; i suppose u wish to accomplish that by telling ppl that they are brainwashed and they're mindless zombies and the like right? even when your input into what their tastes are isn't wanted it seems.

Nipple. :)

Miyu
04-30-2003, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
don't poke the bear in the zoo.
I'm trying to be civil.
but if you won't have that... so be it..

what I think is funny is how your true personal music tastes are near non-existant. just what others around you are into at the monent it seems.

I have a great memory... and I seem to remember a certain date... December 16th... in a thread about favorite bands. and you put ATARI TEENAGE RIOT at the top of the list. ...I don't think you'd ever even heard them.


hhmmmm and that last part... I just love the false-imagery you're putting in people's heads. LOL


just chill out. and call off the dogs.

hmmm dec 16? i don't seem to remember that, sorry. ^^

so now "the bear" is going to "attack" my personal tastes in music? LMFAO! ooooook! that's cool. tell me, o elite musician and god of all that is music: what SHOULD i be listening to? OH I'M SORRY, my music doesn't meet your STANDARDS does it?

you silly little puppet... your posts have successfully demonstrated the whole purpose of my topic... you have turned out to be the poster-child for what I'm talking about :D thank you for your cooperation.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 06:59 PM
blah blah blah whatever

I wasn't attacking anyones tastes in music.

I was speaking more about a lack thereof

Lil Dreamer
04-30-2003, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by KANEDA
blah blah blah whatever

I wasn't attacking anyones tastes in music.

I was speaking more about a lack thereof

a lack thereof by your standards. cuz THEY'RE taste in music doesn't meet yours. and u shove that in their face.

i dunno, telling someone they have no taste in something they enjoy sounds like a blatant attack to me. especially when that input wasn't wanted to begin with.

coming from an artist (illustration and graphic design) and a songwriter, i find your attitude towards your fellow man appalling. and u have no right to tell me or whoever else here what tastes we have none or lacking of just because we don't meet, say it with me now: YOUR STANDARDS.

Nipple. :)

evaneko
04-30-2003, 07:07 PM
Well, i agree that some fans can get in way over there heads, and just become the music that they listen to, and i really don't agree with that. It is one thing to understand where an artist is comeing from, but another entirely to devote all your time, thought and money to it. So, I agree with Miyu on that one.

However, as and "artistic type" here is my 2 cents are being obessed with art. I beleive that obsession with what you do promotes true brilliance. For me there is no moderation with my art- be it writing or playing music, or painting, or drawing, or anything at all! It is a part of me that I cannot escape, and it never becomes old or boring or tiresome (at least not yet ^^) How will you know how far you can go if you try to keep it moderate? Sounds like a total waste of potential to me. Talent isn't always enough. Sorry for that bit of OTness...

Enough of that... to create art for a living i totally agree that it has to sell. You have to make the stuff that aopeals to fans, viewers, listeners, whatever. However, there is something to be said for pure art- art created for its own sake. I think it is really a shame that so little un-bastardized art can be produced without the artist starving, but that's how it is ne?

well sorry for rambling, hope that made sense ^^

eva

Miyu
04-30-2003, 07:07 PM
oh no guys, KANEDA says i have no taste in music.

boo fuckin hoo. :)

at least i can enjoy what i listen to and not be completely consumed by it. here's an idea: go get a new fucking hobby and quit beating everyone over the head with your repetitiveness.

this is retarded. would someone PLEASE make an intelligent reply pertaining to the POINT of this thread? kthx. ^_^

Miyu
04-30-2003, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by Lil Dreamer
a lack thereof by your standards. cuz THEY'RE taste in music doesn't meet yours. and u shove that in their face.

i dunno, telling someone they have no taste in something they enjoy sounds like a blatant attack to me. especially when that input wasn't wanted to begin with.

coming from an artist (illustration and graphic design) and a songwriter, i find your attitude towards your fellow man appalling. and u have no right to tell me or whoever else here what tastes we have none or lacking of just because we don't meet, say it with me now: YOUR STANDARDS.

Nipple. :)


Bravo! Very well said Marc.

Tenjou
04-30-2003, 07:11 PM
Well.. it seems to me that Kaneda is right about some things. Like Miyu probably is. You guys both have your opinions, and if you keep fighting I doubt it will get anywhere...

And even if you have your opinions... you can't fight the world on it.

Lil Dreamer
04-30-2003, 07:17 PM
yup, don't get me wrong. on alot of levels i agree with kaneda's points. it's the presentation of his beliefs that i have a problem with. not with him as a fellow artist.

Nipple. :)

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by Lil Dreamer
a lack thereof by your standards. cuz THEY'RE taste in music doesn't meet yours. and u shove that in their face.

i dunno, telling someone they have no taste in something they enjoy sounds like a blatant attack to me. especially when that input wasn't wanted to begin with.

coming from an artist (illustration and graphic design) and a songwriter, i find your attitude towards your fellow man appalling. and u have no right to tell me or whoever else here what tastes we have none or lacking of just because we don't meet, say it with me now: YOUR STANDARDS.

Nipple. :)


again again AGAIN... missed my point. LOL
but I think you're getting it a bit..

hard to put across.

too much mis interpretation....

xx LuPiN III xx
04-30-2003, 07:30 PM
guhhhh chris

xx LuPiN III xx
04-30-2003, 07:32 PM
hey testecles

xx LuPiN III xx
04-30-2003, 07:35 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Miyu
I like to eat shit-ios for breakfast and then i turned on by 3 year olds
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BlueLady
04-30-2003, 07:39 PM
tastes are subjective and so are opinions. Kaneda chill, and if you want people to stop attacking you stop posting.

Viral Harvest
04-30-2003, 07:41 PM
Jesus Christ, this shit is still going on? Not to be an asshole, but what the hell is ANYONE trying to prove here? Like I said in my first post, you can't argue the facts. Can't people just accept that different people have different views on things and whether that may be a positive or negative thing, these are things that get people through each day of their life. Why try to break it? Why not let people come to their own realizations?

There's no such thing as assistance when you're dealing with the way people think and the way they live their lives. Just let it be. This is how a loop of pointless arguements start. People need to stop fighting so much, jeez, life is worth more than petty arguements.

I will tell you this though, we don't live in the pioneer days anymore. You can no longer gather what you need to live. Yup, that's what currency's for. You need to make a living or you'll be left behind. It's a fucked up world where we have to conform to survive but that's just the way it is. No one has to like it, but if you want to survive, you gotta do what you gotta do. It's a kill or be killed situation. Welcome to the social evolution of the human race. This is reality. Complaints and isolation don't get anyone anywhere. Fuck pride, because this is the only chance we might ever get and nothing's worth more than the well-being of our lives and those we love.

Jeez, Nuff' Said.

Miyu
04-30-2003, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by xx LuPiN III xx
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Miyu
I like to eat shit-ios for breakfast and then i turned on by 3 year olds
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



ooooh that's fuckin witty, liam. your high level of intelligence never ceases to amaze me. that must be why you're still with Taka right? :) rofl!

viral is right.

let's get back on topic now.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 08:02 PM
Originally posted by Miyu
ooooh that's fuckin witty, liam. your high level of intelligence never ceases to amaze me. that must be why you're still with Taka right? :) rofl!

viral is right.

let's get back on topic now.

#1. that isn't Liam. he's not even on these stupid boards.

#2. Taka doesn't even like you... so you shouldn't talk.

KANEDA
04-30-2003, 08:05 PM
Originally posted by Viral Harvest
Jesus Christ, this shit is still going on? Not to be an asshole, but what the hell is ANYONE trying to prove here? Like I said in my first post, you can't argue the facts. Can't people just accept that different people have different views on things and whether that may be a positive or negative thing, these are things that get people through each day of their life. Why try to break it? Why not let people come to their own realizations?

There's no such thing as assistance when you're dealing with the way people think and the way they live their lives. Just let it be. This is how a loop of pointless arguements start. People need to stop fighting so much, jeez, life is worth more than petty arguements.

I will tell you this though, we don't live in the pioneer days anymore. You can no longer gather what you need to live. Yup, that's what currency's for. You need to make a living or you'll be left behind. It's a fucked up world where we have to conform to survive but that's just the way it is. No one has to like it, but if you want to survive, you gotta do what you gotta do. It's a kill or be killed situation. Welcome to the social evolution of the human race. This is reality. Complaints and isolation don't get anyone anywhere. Fuck pride, because this is the only chance we might ever get and nothing's worth more than the well-being of our lives and those we love.

Jeez, Nuff' Said.



not really man, I know plenty of people that don't have to conform to shit and they survive just fine.
ya know.. Live simply so others can simply live.

BlueLady
04-30-2003, 08:23 PM
If these boards are so stupid, why are you here?? heh heh hmmm???

Maryssa
04-30-2003, 08:25 PM
You guys are really pushing it now. Please take this off the boards =/ this thread is deteriorating

~ninja mod

Miyu
04-30-2003, 08:26 PM
Taka and I talk quite frequently, thanks, I think I'm better friends with her than you are or ever were. she told me all about what happened with her and liam and how psycho you were when i dumped your sorry ass (which i should've done sooner... damn my procrastination).

just drop the whole thing, chris. leave this topic. go away. shoo. :D

Miyu
04-30-2003, 08:28 PM
maryssa if youre a mod (i dunno who all the mods are), could you close this thread please? its gotten horrendously off-topic, and now its nothing more than a shit-flinging fest. I know i'm partially to blame... but the topic isn't really serving any purpose other than everyone pissing eachother off. thank you. :)

Studmaster
04-30-2003, 08:37 PM
But, Thread closed.

edit by maryssa: spotlight stealer!! ;D j/k