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Quantum9
07-12-2008, 12:31 AM
Probably best to keep all discussion on the event in this thread (predictions, press conference discussion, game announcements, etc.)

So yeah, it's next week. And it's probably gonna rule.

FinalEVA
07-12-2008, 07:46 PM
Here is the full schedule...

Monday, July 14

* 10.30am - Microsoft press conference
* 12.30pm - Square Enix press conference
* 1.00pm - Shane Kim roundtable
* 3.00pm - EA press conference
* 7.00pm - Gears of War 2 reception

Tuesday, July 15

* 9.00am - Show floor opens
* 9.00am - Nintendo press conference
* 11.30am - Sony press conference
* 2.30pm - Ubisoft press conference
* 4.30pm - Capcom press conference

Wednesday, July 16

* 9.15am E3 Keynote by Gov. Perry
* 10.00 am Sony roundtable
* 10.45am Take-Two press conference
* 1.00pm State of the Industry keynote
* 2.30pm Konami press conference

http://www.ff-xiii.net/index.php?page=news&p=more&numb=262

TransurrealisTristan
07-12-2008, 08:49 PM
Anything on the following:

Soul Calibur IV
Fire Emblem DS

That's all I got...^^;

TybaltFlux
07-12-2008, 09:08 PM
On the tailcoats of Kotaku, predictions, peeps? As far as I got:

Nintendo: Animal Crossing and Donkey Kong for the Wii, plus a 'real' Wii Zelda game and a new DS redesign.

Microsoft: X-waggle, 'nuff said. Unless they unveil a new Halo game.
Which is possible. Sorta, yeah.

Sony: ...um...some stuff about FFXIII/Square in general, possibly a new chip or something. Maybe a new PSP. Ionno, impress me Sony :/.

Plus all the other sequels to all the other games that everyone's been looking forward to, of course.

Quantum9
07-13-2008, 12:22 AM
Here's my expectations for the three press conferences:

Microsoft: Show off what we expect: Gears 2, Banjo, Viva Pinata, Halo Wars, Fable 2. Forza 3 will probably get a trailer. The big surprise will be Halo Chronicles, which is whatever the hell Peter Jackson is working on with Bungie.

Nintendo: The biggest question mark of the conference. Right now they have nothing for Fall 08, meaning that this conference will either be epic fail or just plain epic. Animal Crossing is a no-brainer, and I'm hoping for Kid Icarus and Punch-Out as well. Pikmin 3 and a new Zelda would be nice but I'm not holding my breath for either

Sony: We pretty much know what they'll show - more on Resistance 2, Killzone 2, INfamous, and (hopefully) White Knight Story. Hopefully FFXIII will be shown off in the same way MGS4 was last year as the next major third-party exclusive. Ratchet & Clank Future 2 has been rumored, so expect that to show up. A God of War 3 trailer is a given.

As for third-parties, Fallout 3, the PlatinumGames titles, and Dead Space are all holding my interest. Of course, they all pale to RE5, which will likely be the hands-down Best in Show.

FinalEVA
07-13-2008, 12:46 AM
What I expect...

Microsoft: Shooters
Sony: Shooters
Nintendo: Casual Titles

Joking Aside...

What Quantum said... I really hope to see a FF XIII revealing. It's time for that game to get into the PS3 spotlight, like MGS4 was the last year. E3, I expect the games with Western appeal to be emphasized more so that's why I said "Shooters."

I am curious to see if Sony and M$ go the way of waggle controls. I have seen the "Darwin" controller and I'm not sure what to think about it.

Nintendo will probably announce their next "Wii (insert name)" game that will sell like hotcakes. I hope we see a proper Zelda game announced.

derelict_
07-13-2008, 03:37 AM
Unless they unveil a new Halo game.


o lawd and gawd.

Archelon
07-13-2008, 10:21 AM
Resident Evil 5.

/thread

DrKonaa
07-13-2008, 11:11 AM
*Sigh* Times like this in which I really had G4 so I could at least watch it on T.V. Would love to see the big trailers live...

Mesoian
07-13-2008, 11:58 AM
www.gametrailers.com

They usually have simulcasts. If not, they'll have HD versions of the trailers up.

JaxReaper
07-13-2008, 12:48 PM
MS: I want to hear more about the new Halo project, and to see more on Halo Wars. I'm not a big fan of RTS on consoles, but I'll probably get this one cuz I'm a fan boy.

NINTENDO: They are going to announce the Wii was an epic joke, and to reveal their new console releasing later this year. Nah, I'm just dissapointed with the number of Wii games that I've actually enjoyed. Kudos to them for being so popular though.

Sony: Don't have a PS3...probably never will. Don't really look forward to anything from them.

demifiend
07-13-2008, 02:26 PM
If we have an announcement for a new X-COM game (there's a rumor) made by the Bioshock team, listen carefully for the sonic boom and spectacular fireworks display coming from San Diego. That will be my head unable to contain the excitement.

mastershambler
07-13-2008, 02:48 PM
I am going to start holding my breath until Nintendo's press conference. I really hope for a Wii Starfox, Zelda, Animal Crossing,F-Zero, Pikmin and a new original smash hit title.

A New Super Mario Bros. 2 for the Ds would also be incredible.

Here is hoping for more Resident Evil 5 goodness and Soul Calibur 4 trailers. I would also like to see new trailers for Castlevania Order of Ecclesia and Castlevania Judgement.

I would also appreciate any new 2D fighters making their way stateside.

Archelon
07-14-2008, 11:35 AM
Just a heads up, the Microsoft Press Conference is in a half an hour.

FinalEVA
07-14-2008, 11:42 AM
Ninty just announced a 1:1 device for the Wii right before the M$ press conference started. "Wii MotionPlus"

http://www.nintendo.com/whatsnew/detail/eMMuRj_N6vntHPDycCJAKWhEO9zBvyPH

Makes me wonder if they are trying to upstage something M$ has planned. Good news for gamers like myself that have had issues with the precision and accuracy of the Wii-Mote.

Quantum9
07-14-2008, 03:47 PM
Here's my thoughts on MS's showing:

All the games were quite awesome, RE5 especially. Gears 2 looks greast, but I'm upset that there won't be straight 4-player co-op instead of the wave-after-wave thing. Portal 2 for XBLA (ZOMG!), and FFXIII is a huge boon

However, no matter what you say, Avatars are a Mii ripoff. Period. And where was Forza 3? Anything from Bungie? Lots of questions still to answer.

This definitely opens up Nintendo to have a mondo show especially with the new attachment. As for Sony, they may have just gotten pwned right out of the conference after the FFXIII megaton.

FinalEVA
07-14-2008, 06:41 PM
Besides the FF XIII Deathblow, there is an obvious refocus of the market on casual gaming. I'm kind of sad to see that happen, but it's inevitable. Hardcore gamers are no longer running the show.

makeshiftwings
07-14-2008, 10:12 PM
However, no matter what you say, Avatars are a Mii ripoff. Period.

That was effing ridiculous. Completely.
I could just see Bill Gates when the Wii came out going, "Miis, huh...? Hmmm... >_> <_<"

RE5 looks incredible. Co-op mode? Wow @_@

And agreed, FFXIII was definitely a deathblow XD!

LordDeus
07-14-2008, 10:23 PM
I'm looking forward to:

Shenmue III
Grim Fandango II
Xenogears II
Chrono Break
TIE-Fighter 2
Killer Instinct III



.... what?

TheAnarCHris
07-14-2008, 10:54 PM
I'm looking forward to:

Shenmue III
Grim Fandango II
Xenogears II
Chrono Break
TIE-Fighter 2
Killer Instinct III



.... what?

I hate myself, but I LOLed.

Games I looking foward too:
Something worth buying on my psp that isn't Squenix related.
Something worth buying on my Wii that isn't Mario related.
The bazillion sequels/ports/remakes coming out on the DS/360/XBLA that give me a nerd boner.

FinalEVA
07-15-2008, 11:25 AM
Watching the Nintendo one. Much rambling on about expanding the audience blah blah.

Mesoian
07-15-2008, 12:14 PM
What a boring presser.
Boo nintendo. You needed to announce something big.

Quantum9
07-15-2008, 12:20 PM
Very disappointing from Nintendo. Same as last year...lots of casual stuff and next to nothing for the hardcore.

This is a real shame. I'm starting to think that even Nintendo's own fanbase is getting rather sick of this. I certainly am.

Here's hoping for some stealth announcements.

JaxReaper
07-15-2008, 12:23 PM
Just got done watching the Nintendo Conference, and I'm not sure what was worse...the games or the pathetic attempts at humor. But seriously, Animal Crossing is the only thing they showed that I'm even remotely excited about.

The motion plus thing would have been nice a year and a half ago. It most likely won't work with titles released prior to it, so I see no reason to pick it up. I really don't know if I'll purchase another Wii game ever. My days as a Nintendo fanboy are numbered.

Mesoian
07-15-2008, 12:24 PM
I'm looking forward to:

Shenmue III
Grim Fandango II
Xenogears II
Chrono Break
TIE-Fighter 2
Killer Instinct III



.... what?

The most amusing thing about that list is that 2 of those may get announced this week.

makeshiftwings
07-15-2008, 12:31 PM
So upset over Nintendo x_X So boring!

I was awaiting the amazing announcement at the end... Maybe like a God-sent new Zelda game XD

Animal Crossing looks the best out of everything, but it doesn't look like they changed enough from the first one.

Dojo
07-15-2008, 12:33 PM
I'm wondering how the heck they are going to make GTA work on the DS.

FinalEVA
07-15-2008, 01:02 PM
That was one boring conference. Sales stats and casual stuff. I was expecting them to announce Kingdom Hearts or Zelda at least. But I think that does it, I won't need a Wii this generation. I'll stick to the PS3 and 360, and I'll be using the 360 much more and the PS3 much less than I had originally intended.

Sony up in 30 minutes... They better have something good exclusive to them. It won't be FF 13 obviously now.

Oshi
07-15-2008, 01:17 PM
Voicechat on Wii? Has hell frozen over?

But that's really about the only interesting thing there... Very disappointing.

Let's see how Sony goes. Because MS is still winning this thing.

Lady Muramasa
07-15-2008, 01:31 PM
Voicechat on Wii? Has hell frozen over?

But that's really about the only interesting thing there... Very disappointing.

Let's see how Sony goes. Because MS is still winning this thing.

Exactly, it was very boring.
FF XIII on xbox, not a deathblow for me, too bad for Sony though.
But damn was I NOT entertained watching E3. And what the hell was the zoomed out version while *Surprising* people with the FFXIII trailer? WTF! It's all over the net in HD!!!! Idiots. I might, might, be interested in Sony's news, but really all it's going to be is, FFXIII, Little Big Planet(wtf?) and RE 5, and the long, pushed back many ridiculous times, SONY HOME....and then again we may not even see that until 2010 or so.






"JUST GIMME SOME GAAAAAAMMES!!!" (yelled out in Queen's Gimme the Prize tone)

FinalEVA
07-15-2008, 01:38 PM
Exactly, it was very boring.
FF XIII on xbox, not a deathblow for me, too bad for Sony though.
But damn was I NOT entertained watching E3. And what the hell was the zoomed out version while *Surprising* people with the FFXIII trailer? WTF! It's all over the net in HD!!!! Idiots. I might, might, be interested in Sony's news, but really all it's going to be is, FFXIII, Little Big Planet(wtf?) and RE 5, and the long, pushed back many ridiculous times, SONY HOME....and then again we may not even see that until 2010 or so.






"JUST GIMME SOME GAAAAAAMMES!!!" (yelled out in Queen's Gimme the Prize tone)

I'm REALLY REALLY hoping to see some new hardcore games - not new casual games or games we know about or taken from another console. I want to hear about Team Ico or something.

First party games are the only ones exclusive this generation on any console. Bioshock and FF XIII prove this.

4ng31
07-15-2008, 03:16 PM
O Sony...why can't you understand that people want GAMES.

God dammit man, give us games and not this stupid movie rental shit that Live already has, and has had for what, a year now?

Ugh...depressing conference was depressing...

LordDeus
07-15-2008, 03:18 PM
What a disappointing morning... Nintendo's showing was a complete bust, and Sony's was almost as underwhelming.

But Sony did show some things that were interesting:
Resistance on PSP looks unbelievable (this is how portable games SHOULD look in 2007-2009)
God Of War 3's trailer was cool but lackluster
MAG looks awesome! But I'm a huge Battlefield fan so this hits close to my gaming heart.

I think they focused too much on unnecessary added functionalities on the PS3... I mean they spent a good 15-20min on the fact that we can rent movies on the PSN now. Big deal! Show me something I CANNOT do on my 360!

GT-TV? Unless you're a die-hard motorhead this isn't much to get excited about, and definitely not something people will swoon over upon seeing at an E3 conference.

I'm a lil disappointed. Microsoft wins the conference battle in my eyes. Kudos to them!

FinalEVA
07-15-2008, 03:28 PM
Disappointing in general. MS wins this conference for sure. I guess this confirms the Xbox 360 as my #1 console this generation. That's where the jRPG support is. Sony is so focused on shooters but I will keep it for media features and some of the first party titles. Nintendo just distanced themselves even further from me after this conference.

Quantum9
07-15-2008, 03:48 PM
I actually liked Sony better than MS. They didn't have the punch-in-the-guy announcement that MS had, but they showed off some wicked cool stuff (Resistance 2, LittleBigPlanet, GOW 3, inFAMOUS, MAG) and got me a bit more jazzed for the PS3. I'd give them an B+ overall. Nintendo gets a C- from me, and that's generous.

Overall, another craptacular E3. Dammit, go back to the old format of the mondo show. If it continues like this I worry for the industry's growth.

TheAnarCHris
07-15-2008, 10:06 PM
M$'s conference would have been kinda meh as last year, had it not been for the nuke that was FF13 on the 360. But at last, no release date. BUT OH HAI BUNGIE, WHAT ARE YOU UP TOO YOU SNEAKS?

Nintendo....man, WTF man, WTF. Wii Sports 2? AC:Wii? Wii Music? No mention of Wario or Kirby? F-

Sony spent too much time bsing, but at least they flexed their 1st party muscles with R&C, inFAMOUS, R2, R PSP, Littlebigplanet, MAG and DCU Online. Also, I'll give them some leeway, as they'll get some J-love come the TGS.

Either way, it seems another lacklust E3, unless some win manages to come out the next couple days. Personally, the only thing that made me excited to was the Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 trailer....

Archelon
07-16-2008, 12:02 AM
Overall, I'd say this E3 has been even more disappointing than last year's. Resident Evil 5 was the only saving grace for me (big surprise, I know). Everything else has just been a whole lot of "meh." I am, however, more interested in Fallout 3 now than I was before E3, so take that as you will.

As for the press conferences, MS won hands down, if for shock value alone. However, I think their conference was also much better paced than Nintendo and Sony's.

Fong
07-16-2008, 04:08 AM
Big Shocker: Sony sucks again.

I'm so sad =/ I need a reason to buy a PS3, and Metal Gear isn't enough. I was hoping to hear SOMETHING good...but to no avail.

I'm happy that XIII is coming out on the 360 now (I already own one), but....blast, I will never need to own a PS3 XD

Sony better keep the license to the Kingdom Hearts franchise, otherwise I might just keep my Xbox for everything I'll ever need....O_O

Archelon
07-16-2008, 02:09 PM
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/ Oh Penny Arcade. XD

JaxReaper
07-16-2008, 04:12 PM
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/ Oh Penny Arcade. XD

That's comedy.

On another note...

http://www.bungie.net/News/content.aspx?type=topnews&cid=14782

Bungie backpedals just before they are supposed to announce something new. Big suprise there. Of course they are saying the publisher told them not to at the last possible minute. I think it was all a big scam trying to get people wondering. Not to say that they aren't working on something, just that they were never going to announce it.

Quantum9
07-16-2008, 06:57 PM
Considering the quality of this year's E3, I don't blame them. This may be the worst one I've ever covered, and that includes 2003.

TransurrealisTristan
07-16-2008, 08:31 PM
Only thing I was looking forward to was SCIV at E3 this year.:( Any new news?

E3 is going downhill...and so is the gaming industry.Or...it is "Declining"?*hint hint*

TybaltFlux
07-16-2008, 09:32 PM
We can't blame E3 for sucking so much after it got downsized. Makes it seem less special. Add in the fact that we're somewhere in the middle of the supposed life-span of the PS3, Wii and DS are going strong, and M$ is just happy-go-lucky, and I guess we shouldn't have expected too much from them.

At least, there's always Tokyo Game Show to look forward to?

new_ike
07-16-2008, 11:35 PM
I'm actually kinda looking forward to GT-TV (the prologue demo looked good), and I don't consider myself a "serious gearhead". Top Gear is fun as hell to watch, as is Best Motoring and OPTION (from what I saw in a DVD bundled with an issue of Super Street from a couple years back). Throw in some excitable japanese play-by-play for the D1 GP events, and I'm sold.

...well, that is, if a lot of that stuff is going to be free. I mean, you already paid $39.99 for a demo of a full version, they should at least throw you a bone from time to time.

Smuffy
07-17-2008, 07:13 AM
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/ Oh Penny Arcade. XD

Just too good. Haha


Did anyone see this? Thanks kotaku for getting me psyched all over again :rockon:

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/36747.html

Oshi
07-17-2008, 07:39 AM
Three words. That's all it took.

"We're making Pikmin" -Miyamoto

TheGreyFox
07-17-2008, 08:47 AM
I think this year and possibly next the 360 shall dominate. OK yeah Ps3 has FF vvs. XIII, Resistance 2, and MSG4 in their arsenal but for me 360 has Fable 2, Fallout 3 (looks so good), Red Faction Guerilla (ima RF fan so sue me *is this 360 Exclusive?*), Gears 2 and now FFXIII. Oh yeah, getting a PS3 can wait now....since Enix allowed XIII to be put on 360 i hope the do the same for KH3, i'd hate to spend some $450 on a system and ONLY use it for one game lol

Infernoman
07-23-2008, 06:33 PM
I'm REALLY REALLY hoping to see some new hardcore games - not new casual games or games we know about or taken from another console. I want to hear about Team Ico or something.

I can see tht no matter what happens...SOMEONE who claims to be hardcore will bitch...on noes! FFXIII is now multiplatform...Sony is FINISHED! LOL enjoy paying MORE money for MS and X-box live for avatars and crap you don't want! nintendo is going FULL casual! umm...the way I see it their games were ALWAYS about casual gamers...In my recollection, Nintendo has been making kid-friendly games for 2 decades. Their consoles hold titles that are mature, but I don't believe I've ever seen a Mario game with Bowser raping Peach, or a Zelda game with gore.

after arguing with a friend about games, I begin to wonder what is the definition of a hardcore game? Is it simply the blood, guts, and (terribly done) Adult language and situations? The mature rating? The amount of hours you have to put in to reach a point where you don't feel like you've wasted your money? You have to admit...nintendo is damn good at this casual thing...and if nothing else simple or not they always make games that you'll be SOMEWHAT interested in playing. for they'll become the Apple of video games...

Also when this is talked about then I would ask people who say they're hardcore, do you give a damn if I consider myself a hardcore gamer? no. I have been gaming for 15 years and played just about everything from pokemon to Doom to MGS to Sonic...does THAT make me a hardcore gamer? well again I ask you...do you even care? I mean who's the one to judge if we're hardcore or not? pretty much people self proclaim they're hardcore based on whatever crap they can think of.

I play games and love what I play. that is all.

one more thing...I have been saying since the start of this gen that...X360 will be the PS2 of this gen...

4ng31
07-23-2008, 06:51 PM
one more thing...I have been saying since the start of this gen that...X360 will be the PS2 of this gen...

Which is exactly why the Wii has surpassed it in sales right...

As for the hardcore crowd, I've been playing games for roughly 20 years now..first was Joust on Atar...I've played some games at a "professional" level...LAN tournies/MLG for cash prizes. To me, games that can be played at that level, or enjoyed by that crowd, are the hardcore gamer. The Counter-Strikes, the Halo's, Socom's, CoD's, GoW, etc, etc...

Those are the games that apply to the hardcore crowd IMO. Last generation, we were full of games like that....this gen, not so much, or at least not at the quantity as there was...it SEEMS that style of game is getting washed out by all the shit that is released on the Wii (fitness, sports, etc...) and the sales numbers reflect that. Why dump millions into the development of a game like Bioshock, just to have it outsold by an advanced version of Jazzercise? That's what the hardcore crowd is pissed about...at least, that's my assumption.

Archelon
07-23-2008, 07:19 PM
The whole "hardcore vs. casual" argument is just video gaming's form of elitism and the sense of entitlement that comes with it. It's the same for all hobbies and pasttimes.

And I'll just leave it at that.

Oshi
07-23-2008, 07:31 PM
Wii will definitely be the PS2 of this gen; All the small-time, easy-to-dev shit games will end up on it!

Infernoman
07-23-2008, 10:11 PM
Which is exactly why the Wii has surpassed it in sales right...

but the X360 is THE console just about all games start off on then get ported around. And I will stand by what I said. Also sales are just only part of the bigger equation...but I have expressed this on so many other forums arguing it is really pointless as it makes no difference to me nor many others.

The whole "hardcore vs. casual" argument is just video gaming's form of elitism and the sense of entitlement that comes with it. It's the same for all hobbies and pasttimes.

And I'll just leave it at that.

thank you...play what you like as we're all gamers...plain and simple.

Pliskin
07-23-2008, 11:20 PM
The whole "hardcore vs. casual" argument is just video gaming's form of elitism and the sense of entitlement that comes with it. It's the same for all hobbies and pasttimes.

And I'll just leave it at that.

"I'm going to state my opinion as fact, and then leave because I don't want anyone to show that its an uninformed opinion." translated.

Nintendo is killing videogames as an art form. They're destroying the game industry.

And I'll just leave it at that. See what I did there?

Quantum9
07-23-2008, 11:51 PM
Killing the industry as an art form, maybe. But I don't see where they are killing the industry altogether when it has reached record profits in 2008.

And Oshi, the PS2 had its share of shovelware, to be true. But it also had arguably the best lineup of any console ever, excluding (in my opinion) the Super Nintendo. The 360 is a contender for that spot too, but we'll have to wait for 2 more years to see if it holds up. The problem is, the Wii doesn't have the good games the other guys have. That's an inarguable fact. Hence, even though it's #1 in sales, it's hard for me to consider the Wii the overall winner because it's the first console ever that isn't the winner in both consoles sales and console quality. Every console winner (NES, SNES, PS1, and PS2) had the best games of their generation. That isn't the case with Wii, which is why it's hard for me to call it the winner. But since sales are usually what consoles are judged by, then that's the way it is.

Then again, it's going to be an interesting few months. Although I'm not a fan of the "Wii is a fad" arguement, I don't know if Nintendo is making a safe move in completely abandoning not only their lost fans (which is a LOT of people), but their own fanboys in lieu of the casual audience - a notoriously fickle one that jumps all over the next big thing, casting aside the old one whenever that occurs. I've never been the biggest fan of Adam Sessler from XPlay, but he makes a good point when he says that Nintendo is like the uncool kid from those after-school specials that suddenly becomes cool, but in doing so abandons his fellow uncool friends. However, the end is always the same - the kid loses his cool friends, and having abandoned his previous friends, finds himself without any friends at all. Nintendo could very quickly find themselves without a market if this occurs...and in turn, their famously high profits.

Then again, it'll be hard to do with the relatively weak attempts Sony and MS are making to stop it. Sony is trying to chug along the path, making some good games, but are slowly but surely losing their biggest asset - their wide array of third party exclusives. Now, two of the holy trinity (Grand Theft Auto, Final Fantasy, and Metal Gear Solid) have fallen, and it'll be hard to convince gamers to pick up a PS3 over the games-rich and far cheaper 360. Personally, I think Sony should concentrate less on games and more on their biggest asset: Blu-Ray. Sony is the sole user of the only next-gen format, and I think they need to start taking advantage of that. Start forcing movie companies to release big films Blu-Ray only. Yeah, it would hurt profits, but remember what having DVD did for the PS2. Blu-Ray could do the same for PS3 if only Sony started to market it properly.

As for MS, well, they're ripping off Nintendo wholesale. What's to say. They want a piece of Nintendo's pie and quite frankly, it's stupid. They still have a huge market of gamers eager for the next Gears or Halo game, and to be honest, they don't need anything more than that. Let Nintendo have their bottle and do what you do best - the best online service on the market, along with the best lineup of all three consoles. Just go with that.

TybaltFlux
07-24-2008, 12:31 AM
Killing the industry as an art form, maybe. But I don't see where they are killing the industry altogether when it has reached record profits in 2008.


100% In agreeance. Stuff is very niche for a while, then it gets poppy. Then it loses its popculture appeal. Sometimes it dies out because of this, sometimes it perserves. See: the TCG world when Pokemon and Yugioh hit; electronic dance music; crap, any type of music, punk for that matter; etc. Point is, the stuff exists despite the glitter put on it.

I'm a Nintendo fanboy, though I try to be subjective. I think they're creating a Wii-world that differs from a gamer's world, and it's not just about snazzy controls- it's just about trying to corner the big casual market. Wii-music is prove of that (and the E3 further supplies evidence with the lack of 'hardcore gamer news'). But I mean, everyone is a culprit of that? GTA4 (with GTA3 arguably starting the pop culture gaming era we're in), Halo, DDR/GH/RB, and now, the Wii. I think those that expected (myself, included) a new Zelda, a New Mario Game, or anything of the sorts, were naive to think that Nintendo would stop milking their best cow and move on to some other cattle (I mean, we didn't get that rumored DS remodel, so more evidence as to why change what's still profitable- just unnecessary work).

[/quote]
As for MS, well, they're ripping off Nintendo wholesale. What's to say. They want a piece of Nintendo's pie and quite frankly, it's stupid. They still have a huge market of gamers eager for the next Gears or Halo game, and to be honest, they don't need anything more than that. Let Nintendo have their bottle and do what you do best - the best online service on the market, along with the best lineup of all three consoles. Just go with that.[/QUOTE]

As much as I agree with the first statement, I don't think it's stupid at all. Why not produce both their big games AND corner another market? It's like, telling Subway not to sell pizza's despite the fact that they're keeping their original consumer base and possibly adding more. I think ANY company wants to replicate and improve upon the innovations of same-field companies. It's for their own good, after all. And, if M$ can keep it real while producing pop-games, then so be it. As long as they keep it real though- otherwise we're stuck with the PS3 as the one niche-system.

FinalEVA
07-24-2008, 04:13 AM
@Inferno, there is a difference between Mario/Zelda and Wii Fit/Play/Music. I've never found blood and gore to be a selling point for games, but many probably do. Probably 80% of the games I play are less than "M" rating. The big difference between Mario / Zelda and Wii Fit / Music is that the latter simulates activities I can easily do in real life. I can go to a baseball field or go to a bowling alley. Going through the Mushroom Kingdom and defeating Bowser to rescue the Princess is not something I can easily do IRL.

As other posters said before me, 360 is like the PS2 in terms of having most of the good games of the generation. The one problem I see with Microsoft is that they are just banging their heads against the wall to be in the market. They have been buying out Sony games and now they are trying to copy the Nintendo interface a little bit. I wish they would innovate more, but that really has not been MS's style.

This generation, Nintendo has been able to change the market cycle. The traditional market cycle goes in the order of Innovators, Early Adopters, Early Majority, Late Majority, and Laggards. The more "hardcore" gamers will buy earlier in the cycle while more "casual" gamers buy later in the cycle. The PS2 is a great example of this. Nintendo this generation, however, was able to make people who would normally buy later in the cycle want to buy the Wii immediately. They need it NOW if they want to be as cool as their neighbors.

Sony has thrown in the towel this generation as far as being a market leader. They have said they won't be able to compete against MS money in securing exclusives and now they are just trying to be profitable.

I do notice Sony is coming out with many unique games this generation like Little Big Planet, Afrika, Fat Princess, etc. They really could be on to something if they continue in that direction in addition to their Blu-ray / Media capabilities, although it may take a while for people to notice. As much as the FF 13 situation is dramatized by fanboys, it probably won't have as much of an effect on sales as people think. In reality, It will probably just further the stalemate between MS and Sony this gen. Japan and Mainland EU don't seem to like the 360 too much.

All three companies are staying in for a while, whether people like it or not. This E3, Sony and Nintendo had a clear positioning statement. Microsoft was vague in their positioning. The first part, they showed stuff that appeals to their core audience (Gears, etc.), then they showed how they want to be more like Ninty (Avatars), and then they showed how they want to be like Sony was (jRPGs / FF).

I thought this was funny take on the Ninty press conference...

http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comics/20080721.jpg

Archelon
07-24-2008, 10:55 AM
"I'm going to state my opinion as fact, and then leave because I don't want anyone to show that its an uninformed opinion." translated.

Nintendo is killing videogames as an art form. They're destroying the game industry.

And I'll just leave it at that. See what I did there?

Thank you for proving my point.

ELFanatic
07-24-2008, 11:00 AM
Then again, it'll be hard to do with the relatively weak attempts Sony and MS are making to stop it. Sony is trying to chug along the path, making some good games, but are slowly but surely losing their biggest asset - their wide array of third party exclusives. Now, two of the holy trinity (Grand Theft Auto, Final Fantasy, and Metal Gear Solid) have fallen, and it'll be hard to convince gamers to pick up a PS3 over the games-rich and far cheaper 360. Personally, I think Sony should concentrate less on games and more on their biggest asset: Blu-Ray. Sony is the sole user of the only next-gen format, and I think they need to start taking advantage of that. Start forcing movie companies to release big films Blu-Ray only. Yeah, it would hurt profits, but remember what having DVD did for the PS2. Blu-Ray could do the same for PS3 if only Sony started to market it properly.


See my issue here is that I'm tired of Sony being nothing but extra media. PSX was a CD player, PS2 was a DVD player, PSP is a mp3 player and now PS3 is a blu-ray player. Stop focusing on NONGAMES and start focusing on GAMES. I have a CD player, I have a DVD player, I'll buy a mp3 player if I gave a damn, and I simply just don't give a damn about blu-ray but you know what I do give a damn about on a console... the games.

sorry, that anger is towards them, not you.

LordDeus
07-24-2008, 02:32 PM
See my issue here is that I'm tired of Sony being nothing but extra media. PSX was a CD player, PS2 was a DVD player, PSP is a mp3 player and now PS3 is a blu-ray player. Stop focusing on NONGAMES and start focusing on GAMES. I have a CD player, I have a DVD player, I'll buy a mp3 player if I gave a damn, and I simply just don't give a damn about blu-ray but you know what I do give a damn about on a console... the games.

sorry, that anger is towards them, not you.

The thing is though, the PS3 is still the best means to obtain a Blu-ray player right now. Personally I appreciate all the options that Sony gives us. Same goes with the 360. I mean its completely unpractical to use the PSP as an MP3 player, but hey, atleast it's there if we want it. Sometimes I even forget that the PSP has a built in web browser so if I'm in need of some info while I'm at a con or something, its pretty easy to find a wifi hotspot in a hotel so boom! Instant internet access! It's all about options. And I hardly think any of the developers should be accused of focusing on those things more than gaming at this point. The focus on Netflix during E3 was a bit long winded... but I just think they are covering their bases right now. I mean none of the companies want the consumer to choose their competition because of a feature they do not have. Sad but I'm sure there's someone out there that picked a 360 for the sole fact that you could rent movies.

Speaking of E3, I'm not sure if anyone has posted this yet, but I found this to hit the nail on the head pretty well. Funny yet somewhat disturbing too. http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/080722.jpg

Pliskin
07-27-2008, 10:53 AM
See my issue here is that I'm tired of Sony being nothing but extra media. PSX was a CD player, PS2 was a DVD player, PSP is a mp3 player and now PS3 is a blu-ray player. Stop focusing on NONGAMES and start focusing on GAMES. I have a CD player, I have a DVD player, I'll buy a mp3 player if I gave a damn, and I simply just don't give a damn about blu-ray but you know what I do give a damn about on a console... the games.

sorry, that anger is towards them, not you.

Clap Hanz
Team Ico
Incognito
BigBig Studio
SCE London
SCE Cambridge
SCE Liverpool
SCE Korea

All these are first-party Sony devs, and all of them are working on games that we've heard very little or nothing about. Sony is making games, don't worry.

Quantum9
07-27-2008, 07:14 PM
"Speaking of E3, I'm not sure if anyone has posted this yet, but I found this to hit the nail on the head pretty well. Funny yet somewhat disturbing too. http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/080722.jpg"

It's also pretty much true. I previously mentioned E3 2003 earlier in this topic, but if anyone remembers, the gaming landscape was VASTLY different back then. I remember afterwards there was really the first serious discussion as to if Nintendo could cut it as a hardware maker anymore, and the prevailing opinion was that, with their lack of major upcoming titles, the gimmicky connectivity system, and with Sony's announcement of jumping into the portable market, that Nintendo should just pack it in and become a 3rd party games maker like Sega did. That was really the time that you saw Nintendo fanboys start to get rather nutty, defending the company at every turn and consistently criticizing the company's detractors. I'll never forget after E3 2004, where everyone in the media was quite pleased with Nintendo's showing, Tommy Tallarico from G4 ripped it a new one, stating that the DS was going to be a major failure and the PSP would put the system under in less than a year. Oh man, the Nintendo fanboy backlash was epic.

Now, even Nintendo's diehards are turning against the company, and Nintendo could care less.

FinalEVA
07-27-2008, 10:56 PM
The DreamCast incident has unfortunately become a big tool of fear among fanboys. It was used against Nintendo about 5 years ago, and this generation, it's being used against Sony. Luckily, Nintendo kept profiting despite the conditions. Sony - as a corporation - is still profiting and they are containing their losses better in their games division. Sega was in huge debt and they didn't sell enough software due to piracy.

Quantum9
07-28-2008, 12:09 AM
The DreamCast incident has unfortunately become a big tool of fear among fanboys. It was used against Nintendo about 5 years ago, and this generation, it's being used against Sony. Luckily, Nintendo kept profiting despite the conditions. Sony - as a corporation - is still profiting and they are containing their losses better in their games division. Sega was in huge debt and they didn't sell enough software due to piracy.

Yes, but you're forgetting about the factor of market share, something Nintendo has never cared about and something Sony and Microsoft base their entire business models around. That was pretty much the theory behind the "Nintendo going the way of Sega" predictions of 2003, that the lion's share of profits for Nintendo was coming from their handheld division. If the PSP did to Nintendo's handheld marketshare what the PS1 and PS2 did to Nintendo's console share, they would see a vast drop in their marketshare and, in turn, a vast drop in profits to the point of massive losses. A lot of people forget that the Dreamcast was actually selling quite well until the PS2 came out and put the last bullet in Sega. I don't think it's hard to see Nintendo facing a similar situation if things went as predicted and the PSP gained a majority hold in the handheld market...it just would have taken a little longer for Nintendo to leave hardware, because as you said, they had no debt. Still as a far smaller company to Sony and Microsoft (I think they were around the same size as Sega, maybe a little bigger), it would have probably been around 5 years, definitely before 2010.

Of course, none of this happened, but there is still a point to everything I just said. As soon as Sega went down, all fingers pointed at Nintendo saying "they're next". Thus, Nintendo's fans rushed to protect their beloved company internet-wide, and hence you saw the birth of Nintendo's famed fanboys.

Infernoman
07-28-2008, 03:32 PM
console loyalty is stupid...I discovered this the day I played MGS2 on PS2 years ago...

in any case, no gaming company cares about you...they care about your money and how much you'll give them by making you THINK they care.

ELFanatic
07-28-2008, 04:17 PM
Yes, but you're forgetting about the factor of market share, something Nintendo has never cared about and something Sony and Microsoft base their entire business models around. That was pretty much the theory behind the "Nintendo going the way of Sega" predictions of 2003, that the lion's share of profits for Nintendo was coming from their handheld division. If the PSP did to Nintendo's handheld marketshare what the PS1 and PS2 did to Nintendo's console share, they would see a vast drop in their marketshare and, in turn, a vast drop in profits to the point of massive losses. A lot of people forget that the Dreamcast was actually selling quite well until the PS2 came out and put the last bullet in Sega. I don't think it's hard to see Nintendo facing a similar situation if things went as predicted and the PSP gained a majority hold in the handheld market...it just would have taken a little longer for Nintendo to leave hardware, because as you said, they had no debt. Still as a far smaller company to Sony and Microsoft (I think they were around the same size as Sega, maybe a little bigger), it would have probably been around 5 years, definitely before 2010.

Of course, none of this happened, but there is still a point to everything I just said. As soon as Sega went down, all fingers pointed at Nintendo saying "they're next". Thus, Nintendo's fans rushed to protect their beloved company internet-wide, and hence you saw the birth of Nintendo's famed fanboys.

I agree with everything you said except I saw nintendo fanboys as soon as N64 peeked up. So basically as soon as sony started to take the market as lead fanboys started popping out of the wood work.

But this is a tangent.

console loyalty is stupid...I discovered this the day I played MGS2 on PS2 years ago...

in any case, no gaming company cares about you...they care about your money and how much you'll give them by making you THINK they care.

You know, I had the same realization from that game. Back then I just cared about what system would have RPGs and then I ended up not liking the large majority of RPGs that came out on it.

But I'm not too keen on the idea of spending the money on three console either so it's nice to see a lead and somebody dragging behind. Helps things out a bit.

JaxReaper
07-28-2008, 11:20 PM
I've been gaming for about 17 years now. I remebmer playing Atari as a kid, and my brother getting a NES, followed by my other brother getting a SNES and a Genesis. I always prefered Nintendo games, and the N64 didn't dissapoint me with games like Mario64, Mario Kart64, LOZ: OoT, SSB, Killer Instinct, Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, etc...The GCN came along and I found myself only playing first-party games on it. Late into the game I got an XBOX and almost completely quit playing my GCN.

Still I was pumped about what was once known as Project Revolution. When the name and gameplay mechanics were revealed I thought it was a horrible idea, but came to accept them both and tried to embrace it. I waited in line on release day and picked one up. I was thrilled with LOZ: TP. Now some time has past and the only games I have purchased are SSBB and MKwii, the latter of the two i'm not all that impressed with. Was it worth it? It's too soon to tell...I hope.

If Nintendo's casual course carries them into the next generation of consoles, I don't know that I will buy whatever it is they release next. I know I can't be the only "fanboy" who feels this way, and I know Nintendo probably doesn't care right now, but one day they might.

All aboard the M$ train! lolz

Leishu
07-28-2008, 11:29 PM
console loyalty is stupid...I discovered this the day I played MGS2 on PS2 years ago...

in any case, no gaming company cares about you...they care about your money and how much you'll give them by making you THINK they care.

If I give you a hug, will you go say this in every console flamewar thread on the first page of the game subforum? Pleeeease? Seriously, this needs to be said over and over, apparently, because some people think still that console success has anything to do with anything other than raw profit and that there's any point for anybody than playing the games that you like and having fun.

It seems that E3 is imploding on itself, and it's more the fault of the people who run it than anything. Hopefully, something as cool as E3 used to be will rise to take its place.

FinalEVA
07-29-2008, 12:05 AM
Yes, but you're forgetting about the factor of market share, something Nintendo has never cared about and something Sony and Microsoft base their entire business models around. That was pretty much the theory behind the "Nintendo going the way of Sega" predictions of 2003, that the lion's share of profits for Nintendo was coming from their handheld division. If the PSP did to Nintendo's handheld marketshare what the PS1 and PS2 did to Nintendo's console share, they would see a vast drop in their marketshare and, in turn, a vast drop in profits to the point of massive losses. A lot of people forget that the Dreamcast was actually selling quite well until the PS2 came out and put the last bullet in Sega. I don't think it's hard to see Nintendo facing a similar situation if things went as predicted and the PSP gained a majority hold in the handheld market...it just would have taken a little longer for Nintendo to leave hardware, because as you said, they had no debt. Still as a far smaller company to Sony and Microsoft (I think they were around the same size as Sega, maybe a little bigger), it would have probably been around 5 years, definitely before 2010.

Of course, none of this happened, but there is still a point to everything I just said. As soon as Sega went down, all fingers pointed at Nintendo saying "they're next". Thus, Nintendo's fans rushed to protect their beloved company internet-wide, and hence you saw the birth of Nintendo's famed fanboys.

As ELF said, I remember it starting with the N64. That's when all the "Nintendo is kiddy" remarks started coming in. It definitely got bad in the GC years.

But yeah, if games I'm interested in are on a non-preferred console / company for me, I will still buy the console regardless. Never cared for MS (Windows ME still leaves a bad taste in my mouth) as a company, but I still got the console to play the games I want to play (LO, ToV, IU, DOA, etc.).

Shiroi Ookami
08-01-2008, 07:05 PM
I just wish that Nintendo would do SOMETHING besides announce more casual game packs. The Wii section in my store is about 2/3 full of nothing but casual game bundles. "Ten mildly interesting games in one package!"

Sadly Nintendo seems to be in "autopilot" mode and producing quick, easy to make games that use motion-sensing in some way.

Out of all of the Wii games out, I would say there are about five or six really worth owning.

Must Haves:
1) Zelda: Twilight Princess
2) SSB: Brawl
3) Metroid Prime 3
4) Super Mario Galaxy

Also worth playing:
5) Fire Emblem (have to be a fan of the series)
6) Bleach: The Blade of Fate (actually a decently playable game)
7) Naruto: CoN Revolution (limited cast, should be fixed in 2nd game)
8) DBZ: Budokai Tenkaichi 3 (probably the best fighter on the Wii)

Want to play:
9) Nights: Journey Into Dreams
10) No More Heroes
11) FF: Chocobo Dungeon
12) Mario Kart (if I could ever find a copy)

Wish List:
Star Fox - Motion sensing flight controls!
Kid Icarus - was the new Pit in SSBB just a tease?
More RPG's (although the DS is doing a good job of this)

Leishu
08-01-2008, 11:48 PM
I just wish that Nintendo would do SOMETHING besides announce more casual game packs. The Wii section in my store is about 2/3 full of nothing but casual game bundles. "Ten mildly interesting games in one package!"

Sadly Nintendo seems to be in "autopilot" mode and producing quick, easy to make games that use motion-sensing in some way.

Out of all of the Wii games out, I would say there are about five or six really worth owning.

Must Haves:
1) Zelda: Twilight Princess
2) SSB: Brawl
3) Metroid Prime 3
4) Super Mario Galaxy

Also worth playing:
5) Fire Emblem (have to be a fan of the series)
6) Bleach: The Blade of Fate (actually a decently playable game)
7) Naruto: CoN Revolution (limited cast, should be fixed in 2nd game)
8) DBZ: Budokai Tenkaichi 3 (probably the best fighter on the Wii)

Want to play:
9) Nights: Journey Into Dreams
10) No More Heroes
11) FF: Chocobo Dungeon
12) Mario Kart (if I could ever find a copy)

Wish List:
Star Fox - Motion sensing flight controls!
Kid Icarus - was the new Pit in SSBB just a tease?
More RPG's (although the DS is doing a good job of this)

It seems that we do have a couple titles coming up which definitely would qualify within the "hardcore" market. I'll just be playing Soul Calibur 4, and then Spore, until those come out. ^_~