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Ametenshi
06-11-2003, 03:09 PM
This year at Anime Boston, JRock got little to no attention. It was too focused on anime. They said they wanted to do something about it, to make it so JRockers will get more attention, so they want to make a separate masquerade for it. We (Kuroe and I) beleive that this will only shove J-Rock ferther into the corner at Anime Boston. To view more on this subject, go to the animeboston.com forums. Anyways, we ask kindly that anybody who wants to help us in achiving our goal of allowing J-Rockers to be in the main masquerade, please sign the petition at http://geocities.com/jrockroom We guarantee that you won't get in trouble for signing this :) And, if you have anything negative to say about it, you can e-mail Kuroe or myself...our e-mails our both located on that page numerous times. So, feel the J-Rock love!


~*Ametenshi*~

Once again, support it at http://geocities.com/jrockroom

PatrickD
06-12-2003, 01:18 AM
Rest assured that we are currently considering additional JRock programming at Anime Boston. However, at this time, we are not prepared to make any announcements. We ask that you please be patient until that time. Thank you.

Chi
06-12-2003, 01:24 AM
Actually, I'm finding Anime Boston is getting far too much bad publicity about their lack of J-rock Programming. It's a complaint I've seen on almost every forum I've browsed.

However... as a first time con, held in a city were J-rock is not readily available, I feel they did a very good job. They were not anti j-rock; they permitted them into a masquerade that was specifically for anime only costumes. They permitted a panel on J-rock that lasted more then and hour and a half. And, while no one showed for it, they did have a j-rock karaoke hour.

This year, they've appointed a J-rock coordinator. That alone tells me at least that they're interested in improving the selection of events they offer in regards to the music.

While the Masquerade's have been seperated, (and this seems to be final from what I read on the forums...) I think at this point we need to support the events by telling them what we j-rockers want to see, instead of complaining on various forums.

Greggo
06-12-2003, 01:05 PM
Yeah, heaven forbid an anime convention should be too focused on anime.

In other news, the Baseball Hall of Fame has had a protest lodged against it to include more softball coverage because the Hall is too focused on baseball.

davemerrill
06-12-2003, 01:41 PM
Seriously, what's stopping the Mighty Forces Of J-Rock from starting their own convention and saving the rest of us the trouble of having to deal with them? I'm pretty sure Anime Boston has enough to worry about without having to satisfy the whims of a loud, vocal, attention-starved minority.

shiroi_yukiko
06-12-2003, 02:28 PM
I think the fact that they're willing to give the jrock "minority" anything is good enough. ^^ It's better than nothing, right?

Ametenshi
06-12-2003, 02:28 PM
Nothing is stopping us from starting our own convention. But, 'J-Rock is Anime and Anime is J-Rock' (~Kuroe) Like I've said numerous times in other threads, this is because of anime soundtracks which a big part of them is J-Rock, and also because of the popular J-Rock inspired animes and magas, such as Gravitation (my personal favorite)

Mike Toole
06-12-2003, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Ametenshi
Nothing is stopping us from starting our own convention. But, 'J-Rock is Anime and Anime is J-Rock'

Whiskey, tango, foxtrot. Over.

shaman
06-12-2003, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by Ametenshi
Nothing is stopping us from starting our own convention. But, 'J-Rock is Anime and Anime is J-Rock' (~Kuroe) Like I've said numerous times in other threads, this is because of anime soundtracks which a big part of them is J-Rock, and also because of the popular J-Rock inspired animes and magas, such as Gravitation (my personal favorite)

So, why don't you just dress up as a character from Gravitation? As you said that is anime and it is appropriate for an ANIME CONVENTION (not J-Rock Central). J-Rock and anime may be somewhat related, but you usually don't see an anime featuring Animated Hide or animated Malice Mizer. If there were animated Hide or animated Malice Mizer on TV or OVAs or something even remotely related I could see anime conventions supporting you wearing a costume, but that is not how it is the last time I checked. Dressing up like your favorite glamfem J-Rock star has nothing to do with anime. If you want to dress up like your favorite anime character from a J-Rock anime like Gravitation and Kaikan Phrase I can't see what the conflict is. It seems like Anime Boston is working on entire events for your little clique, events that I couldn't give a dam* about myself and quite frankly wouldn't even notice if they were gone, and are probably taking up money that could go to things like guests. I would be thankful that they are going out of their way for you, and if you aren't happy go and start your own convention.

shaman
06-12-2003, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Chi
Actually, I'm finding Anime Boston is getting far too much bad publicity about their lack of J-rock Programming. It's a complaint I've seen on almost every forum I've browsed.

I agree, and it's the same two people complaining. I would advise checking out their petition, they have about 5 people signed on even after vommiting this "crisis" all over the internet. I am not impressed with their behavior. On the other hand, the Anime Boston staff seems to be amazingly supportive of the genre considering that these two fans are determined to cut of their nose to spite their face.

Chi
06-12-2003, 08:59 PM
I do agree that anime/j-rock are related. They're related in the same way the video games and anime are related. J-rock has incorporated anime into their music the way games have incorporated anime into themselves. (Dir En Grey has manga based covers, Malice Mizer has manga featuring them in their fanzines, and X Japan has had animation companies do their music videos for them, like rusty nail.) I also recognize that many mangaka's not only pull their story lines as well as their fashions for their characters from J-rock. Kaikan Phrase and Angel Sanctuary being the two most notorious, partially due to the denials of the Mangakas. Gackt (Former Malice Mizer) has been through at least 2 lawsuits with video game companies at this point, because of their blatant copyright infringement of him with characters like Squall. You can find him in both Final Fantasy 8 and 10.

I think the petition would be understandable if J-rock was originally permitted in the masquerade. But it wasn't. Neither was video game characters that lacked any connection with anime (aka, no anime based sequences.) However, both were in the masquerade due to the fact it was a first year con, and everyone was very relaxed.

We don't even know what's possible in the way of J-rock events yet. Talk to the J-rock coordinator before complaining about it. No one has even made suggestions on ANY forum about what they want to see, and personally, as a J-rock supportor and Panel head at AB last year, I want to know what people are interested in seeing.

Zelly
06-12-2003, 09:29 PM
Whatever you do...I'd recommend you stop spamming people with e-mail and such...*growls* >< Some of the people you've e-mailed aren't even GOING to Anime Boston in the first place.

PatrickD
06-13-2003, 03:52 PM
Originally posted by Chi
and personally, as a J-rock supportor and Panel head at AB last year, I want to know what people are interested in seeing.

You were the head of panel programming at Anime Boston 2003? That's news to me...

Chi
06-13-2003, 07:43 PM
The intro to J-rock panel at AB in April. I did it with Awaresa - Awa did all the correspondance with AB, and I did the research info, and correspondance with other participants. I meant to say i was a panel head - a typo on my part. (Sorry.)

number18
06-13-2003, 08:06 PM
Hmm, yes, from what an acquaintance said in her LJ, start your own convention if you want J-rock. These people are interested in promoting an ANIME convention, not a concert. I wouldn't say J-rock is anime, not at all. That's a bunch of crap. You would have to say ANY band that ever did a song for ANY anime belongs and deserves to have its own programming at a convention. :/ Do the Japanese consider J-rock = anime? It's considered visual kei.

Hmm, this whole thread is just nothing but bait for flaming, if you ask me. There are so many things I could say about why this little cry for justice, but I won't.

If you were unhappy with the lack of a j-rock panel, that's your own fault. There were a billion chances to sign up and do your own panel at Anime Boston. It's very rude to go around complaining like this, pointing fingers because something you liked wasn't "properly represented." Really, if you want to see it, get to work and make it happen - don't go around yelling at people that they should be catering to your needs. :rolleyes:

And I find this line most amusing:
"This year at Anime Boston, JRock got little to no attention. It was too focused on anime. "

Greggo
06-13-2003, 11:28 PM
I like this snippet from the website where the "petition" is:

99.9% of anime is soundtracked by J-Rock.

Someone's got their decimal point in the wrong place there.

Cowboy Bebop has a primarily jazz soundtrack. Would you thus infer that anime is jazz and jazz is anime?

Chi
06-14-2003, 12:34 AM
Even I admit there's very little j-rock in anime to date.... majority of it is classical, with opening themes usually done by J-pop. Oo The only shows that have really used j-rock are shows that involve it, or want a harder edge sound... And that's still on top of the insturmental soundtracks that are released.

Mike Toole
06-14-2003, 12:41 AM
Well, soundtrack isn't actually a verb, to begin with-- don't you hate it when people try to turn nouns into verbs, when perfectly good verbs already exist?-- but to say that 99.9% of anime features j-rock on the soundtrack is hilariously inaccurate. It's about as accurate as saying that all anime is porn.

Also, the whole visual kei fad has been dead in Japan for something in the neighborhood of two years. That's probably one of the reasons why there've been visual kei bands hitting the convention circuit lately. I think the idea of an open-ended j-rock/pop panel is a cool one, but to devote large segments of programming and resources to a group that is unlikely to number more than somewhere between 50 and 100 seems wasteful.

Beyond that, I don't have a problem with the sad little clowns hanging around the lobby, with their broken Wal-mart umbrellas and their pasty white makeup and LOOOOOOOOOOOVE
LOVE WILL TEAR US APART, MY FRIEND :D :D :D

Chi
06-14-2003, 10:22 AM
[i]Originally posted by Mike Toole [/i

Beyond that, I don't have a problem with the sad little clowns hanging around the lobby, with their broken Wal-mart umbrellas and their pasty white makeup[/b] :D :D :D [/B]

Insulting J-rockers doesn't help, if you haven't noticed. And also... I don't know where you heard that vis kei was dead in Japan, because there's still a constant flow of it with new bands. It's died down a bit in the older bands, but that's nothing new. Psycho le cemu for instance, Mucc, Nightmare... all of these are relatively new vis kei bands who are doing very well market wise.

Duel Jewel is touring the US because there is demand for it in the US, and if you're the only band of that style, people are going to swarm to see you = lots of money. Alot of bands have realized there's a foreign audience and have been looking into ways of reaching them. That's all.

number18
06-14-2003, 06:54 PM
Can we close this thread now? I think it's run its course.

Mike Toole
06-15-2003, 03:21 AM
Originally posted by Chi
Insulting J-rockers doesn't help, if you haven't noticed.

Wait a minute-- who's insulting anybody? I was describing an actual person I saw at Anime Central:
http://www.animejump.com/forumpix/jrockharhar.jpg

(photo courtesy fansview.com)

The greasepaint, the broken dime store umbrella-- those were THERE. I didn't get close enough to her to hear if she was actually humming "Bela Lugosi's Dead", but I like to think she was.

And also... I don't know where you heard that vis kei was dead in Japan,

I've heard it from a few of my friends in Japan, some of whom are actual authentic Japanese people. One of them goes to a lot of fan conventions and participates in costuming activities, and he's indicated that you're far more likely to bump into kids cosplaying as SMAP or Happatai than any visual kei act at this point.

It's a fad, and fads tend to die down after awhile. I really, really, really wish the whole shibuya-kei thing was still going strong, but those days are long behind us. :blubber:

Psycho le cemu for instance, Mucc, Nightmare... all of these are relatively new vis kei bands who are doing very well market wise.

I've seen some Psycho le Cemu stuff. They're a novelty act, kind of like Barnes & Barnes. :rockon:

Duel Jewel is touring the US because there is demand for it in the US, and if you're the only band of that style, people are going to swarm to see you = lots of money.

I'm a little skeptical of this, as the group only drew about 250 people on Saturday evening at ACen. And if a real, live, bona-fide Japanese rock BAND (even without any sort of cartoon tie-in) can't reel several hundred folks in, is prioritizing the music as a general point of discussion such a great idea?

Ametenshi
06-16-2003, 08:56 PM
Okay, maybe to your Japanese friends it is dead, because everybody has different tastes, and they could have grown out of Jrock a while ago, you know, there are still millions of people who listen to it. And, Chi is right, insulting J-Rockers doesn't help. And, I might add, that girl did a pretty nice costume .You obviously don't appreciate J-Rock if you can't appreciate that costume.

Ametenshi
06-16-2003, 09:03 PM
One more thing: I don't understand WHY everybody is making such a huge deal about this: We're only asking for two small things: A small room (much like one of those little panel rooms) dedicated to J-Rock, and to allow J-Rockers in the main masquerade. I mean, it's not much. It's not like there are going to be a thousand Jrockers entering the masquerade!

Koumori
06-16-2003, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by Ametenshi
You obviously don't appreciate J-Rock if you can't appreciate that costume.

Whoa. Okay. I like VK as much as the next guy, but saying you can't appreciate a genre of music if you don't like that girl's dress..? Does not really compute. And... doesn't help your argument, either. By all means present your ideas to Anime Boston, but do it directly.

Ametenshi
06-17-2003, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by Koumori
Whoa. Okay. I like VK as much as the next guy, but saying you can't appreciate a genre of music if you don't like that girl's dress..? Does not really compute. And... doesn't help your argument, either. By all means present your ideas to Anime Boston, but do it directly.


That's not what I meant ^^; I was talking about how he doesnt appreciate her costume-I'm sure she put a lot of effort into it. My bad XD

Ametenshi=Dumb-blonde type person who is mentally ill and needs to go to 'Learn to say what the hell your saying the right way' class o.o;

Mike Toole
06-17-2003, 09:06 PM
Originally posted by Ametenshi
Okay, maybe to your Japanese friends it is dead, because everybody has different tastes, and they could have grown out of Jrock a while ago, you know, there are still millions of people who listen to it.

Really? When was the last time a visual kei band had the #1 album in Japan?

(I'll skip the non-sequitur.)

Originally posted by Ametenshi
One more thing: I don't understand WHY everybody is making such a huge deal about this:

Well, consider this:
In order to make a j-rock room worthwhile, you'll need to do the following things:
--Provide somewhere in the area of 20 hours of programming. 6 hours Friday, 8 hours Saturday, and 4 hours Sunday. That's bare minimum; that doesn't address the possibility of evening programming. Do you have enough panelists lined up?

--You'll also need to maintain audience interest throughout those 20 hours. Do you think you can keep an audience of 20 to 50 entertained? Conventions are often more than happy to hand over some aspect of programming to an outside party, but only if they can keep people interested. For an example, just look at what Greggo's done-- he works his ass off, he packs people in by the hundreds for every one of his events-- yet he only accounts for a few hours of programming at any given con. Maybe seven or eight, tops. (Correct me if I'm wrong, Greggo.) And if you can bring an audience in, is it just going to be the same 20 people at every panel?

We're only asking for two small things: A small room (much like one of those little panel rooms) dedicated to J-Rock, and to allow J-Rockers in the main masquerade. I mean, it's not much. It's not like there are going to be a thousand Jrockers entering the masquerade!

No, but it still strikes me as a bizarre and inappropriate request. Soccer and baseball and mahjongg and "Journey to the West" have a much, much more storied and concrete connection to anime and manga than visual kei has, yet you don't see fans of the stuff demanding that they be given preferential treatment.

In short: What makes you think your fan kink is so special that you should get an entire room for the whole weekend?

The convention only has a limited space to work with-- especially Anime Boston, in the tiny Park Plaza hotel-- and they would very likely be better served to just run a general panel room with an open-ended j-rock panel at some point. Forgive me if I sound bellicose, but I'm genuinely curious. What's the justification for your demands?

Ametenshi
06-18-2003, 03:17 PM
You know, I wasn't trying to make this forum be a big deal and have everybody get pissed off and complain, so, everybody else, you can just sit here and complain about the J-Rockers, but, I'm not going to be a part of this forum anymore: Everybody is making too big a deal out of it -.-; So, consider this my last post in this forum. :)

davemerrill
06-19-2003, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Mike Toole


I'm a little skeptical of this, as the group only drew about 250 people on Saturday evening at ACen. And if a real, live, bona-fide Japanese rock BAND (even without any sort of cartoon tie-in) can't reel several hundred folks in, is prioritizing the music as a general point of discussion such a great idea? [/B]

Dual Jewel only drew 250 people at Central? Heck, I had more people than that screaming "DOG BITE, DAVE! DOG BITE!" during Hell! And I'm not even HALF as pretty!

RichAyanami
06-19-2003, 11:51 PM
Wow, I come back after a month of not checking the forums and all hell's breaking loose.

Okay, if the jrock room wasnt' a practical idea, alright. But the jrock cosplayers should at least be able to participate in the masquerade. There aren't too many to begin with so the masquerade won't suddenly be flooded with 'non-anime-oriented' costumes. At the same time however you can be sure that those cosplayers are going to be there. Also, if the jrock cosplayers are barred from the masquerade, then the same will basically apply to plenty of other non-anime cosplayers, such as all jpop, all EGL, all movies (I've seen xmen, MIB, lord of the rings, harry potter....), all original costumes, and everything else (pocky, domo-kun, generic bishonen...you know them..).

...I've seen jrock cosplayers at every convention I've been to...so...

...my two cents...

Koumori
06-20-2003, 06:36 AM
Fine.. but the j-rock coordinator has said that she agrees with you and has tried to convince the AB staff.. and she's failed. (And I don't have any problem with not seeing Harry Potter in the masquerade.) So, since the staff isn't going to budge on the masquerade issue, if you have ideas for other j-rock programming and it's that important to you, why not come up with some of those programming ideas yourself and bring them to the AB people? You can make this happen if you want to, but you don't seem to be winning the support you're hoping for on this board.