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View Full Version : There is such a thing as OVER moderation (Another Plea For a Reality Check)


concrneddenizen
04-08-2004, 12:10 AM
I have no idea how you can say you pride yourself on having an open site and a friendly community when it seems like the majority of the moderators here spend all of their time nitpicking insignificant interpretations of the overindulgent rules and themselves harassing members. While it is the owner’s board to do with as he chooses, it pains me as a cosplayer and long time poster to see what was such a good and thriving community choked and starved because of what is plainly a case of over moderation. There is a point where a friendly mediator on a bulletin board can become over burdened, and detached, and can cross the line from peace keeper to totalitarian dictator. This was once a place where the moderators struggled with the decision to close even a single thread. Now, threads are closed and moved, and it appears that posters are being banned and scolded, at an insulting rate. This site has well passed the line.

It pains me to see what was such a wonderful and open place turn into such a rotten destination. It was always presumptuous for this site to be titled the internet’s premier cosplay community. It certainly was not the first, and with the restrictions vehemently enforced here, it is hardly the best. Even the sense of community has dwindled greatly since the tragic loss of the off topic and conversation boards. Without conversation, this is not a community, but big question and answer session. It is insulting have asked for reference pictures only to have yourself kicked out or deleted.

It is said that a person should not deny themselves the pleasure of an activity because of the negative behavior of a small group of people. What, then, should a person do when the people who cause the most problems are the ones with the most power? If the moderators have trouble keeping up with the posters, then add more moderators. If they still have trouble, then add more moderators. If the moderators become jaded and bored, give them some time off. The reaction that the moderators, and indeed the site policy, have towards wayward new members has made me actually tell people to avoid joining up here. Also, for having such a great emphasis on every rule being followed exactly, the rules themselves are overwhelmingly lengthy, often vague, and hard to find. Only two links are available, and one has to really look. New members who don’t instantly understand all the nuances of this erratic place are ridiculed and embarrassed by the very people who were once supposed to be there to help. For goodness sake, there’s a rule about not posting in old topics! This makes life that much more difficult as posting what can bee construed as repeat threads are just as snuffed out as many others. Even accidental mentioning of activities that could be thought to be illegal can set off the SS. The word ‘download’ has become the vilest curse word. Even if the owners of the domain do not advocate p2p file sharing, to pounce on the mere mention of the concept as if the devil himself will rise up and suck out your soul for even thinking of it is insane. It’s the online equivalent of a small child sticking his fingers in his ears and singing a song to himself so he doesn’t have to hear what his teacher has to say to him. There are ways to be against a practice, and not facilitate it, while still acknowledging it. Indeed, this board’s policy forbids even posting links to alternative forums that allow the behaviors this board explicitly forbids. If you won’t allow it here, why do you deny advocation of the alternative?

It’s ironic that the very administrator that has a rule about cosplayer bios being open for deletion if the member is not a cosplayer has no pictures of himself in costume in his profile. A bit hypocritical, yes? This is the same administrator who downed the site to flood it with references to ‘lumberjacks’, and yet still has not fixed dozens of bugs and errors in the basic function of the page. The leadership of this board has fallen into two ruts of poor habits. The first is that of the lonely school principal who directed that all complaints and deviants be sent to him and has subsequently allowed himself to grow resentful of even minor annoyances are met with the same cynicism and zero tolerance of legitimate concerns. The second is that of a self appointed leader who, in taking a leadership position of a small group, has assumed an almost god-like ego when it comes the larger ensemble, while maintaining favoritism within their original group. It often seems that in many boards, the only threads the moderators post in are the ones they wish to close, delete, or block. Half of this 'Site Help' forum's threads concern moved, deleted, or closed threads and images. That is not a sign of a healthy board.

Judging by the amount of closed threads that popped up in outrage when the conversation boards were eliminated, I know I am not alone in my beliefs and I’m rather confident that this thread will either be deleted within hours of posting, or closed for being ‘off topic’ or ‘disrespectful’. My intent is not disrespect.

I beg of you all! Please allow people to be people and return this board to its former glory before its reputation begins to tarnish the entire cosplay community at large.

Admin
04-08-2004, 01:04 AM
Hi Cait. (change your IP address too next time if you want to fling anonymous accusations.)

I've removed the stick from my butt (http://forums.cosplay.com/showthread.php?p=667376#post667376) long enough to reply to your anonymous rant.

We have a rule here, and it reads as follows: 4. No posting anything illegal, or any links which lead to anything illegal. No porn, warez, crackz, hackz or roms. No discussion of P2P clients, no discussion of where to download anime.

This rule is in place because all downloading copyrighted material is illegal. It's that simple.

The ban on "discussing" where to download copyrighted material is there because I don't want people circumventing the rule on our boards merely with a wink and a nudge and a link to somewhere else to get it.

For everything else in your rant - the moderators jump on things like this before it gets out of hand. We have a lot of kids on this site, and many of them don't realize the implications of illegal file sharing. So while you may feel it's a bit heavyhanded (enough to compare the mods to the "SS"), I tend to think of it as a moderator enforcing a rule. If people get their feelings hurt because someone closed their thread on where to steal stuff, then oh well.


Even the sense of community has dwindled greatly since the tragic loss of the off topic and conversation boards. Without conversation, this is not a community, but big question and answer session.

This is the second complaint I've received since the day after we closed those boards. Compared to the dozens of compliments, the complaints have a long way to go to catch up. In fact, member logins are up 5% overall since the boards were removed. They must all be confused or something.

It is insulting have asked for reference pictures only to have yourself kicked out or deleted.
It is insulting to think that you would want me to host someone else's copyrighted artwork for your own personal amusement, and against the legal advice of my lawyers.

For goodness sake, there’s a rule about not posting in old topics!
Which was brought about from the numerous member complaints about old topics being resurrected.

Indeed, this board’s policy forbids even posting links to alternative forums that allow the behaviors this board explicitly forbids. If you won’t allow it here, why do you deny advocation of the alternative?
Going up to a cop and asking him where you can find a street without cops in order to commit a crime isn't going to get you very far with the cop.

It’s ironic that the very administrator that has a rule about cosplayer bios being open for deletion if the member is not a cosplayer has no pictures of himself in costume in his profile. A bit hypocritical, yes?
What would you like me to wear? I don't cosplay. Everyone wants me to, not out of spite, mind you, but more out of how amusing it would be. I don't need to either, because nothing I do or say would make anyone think I know a thing about cosplaying. I'm a photographer, and I like to photograph cosplayers. My girlfriend loves to cosplay. So we opened this site, for my love of photography and her love of cosplay. And that's as far as I feel the need to explain myself. In fact that is the first time I think anyone has ever even cared, at least publically.

This is the same administrator who downed the site to flood it with references to ‘lumberjacks’, and yet still has not fixed dozens of bugs and errors in the basic function of the page.
I know of a few bugs, but not dozens. 90% of the bugs are user-side as well. Most of the bugs are people who can't see the galleries, but that's usually a firewall problem that I have zero control over.

The second is that of a self appointed leader who, in taking a leadership position of a small group, has assumed an almost god-like ego when it comes the larger ensemble, while maintaining favoritism within their original group.
Show me where I ever claimed to be your leader and I'll eat my shoe. Show me any moment where I have ever even attempted to use my position for my own advantage.

My intent is not disrespect.
Except when you claim the other person has a stick up his butt.

I beg of you all! Please allow people to be people and return this board to its former glory before its reputation begins to tarnish the entire cosplay community at large.
From what I hear, our reputation has been healed as of late, and not harmed. Of course, most of our reputation hinges on the hurt feelings of members when other members put them down and is played out in livejournal posts around the world as "cosplay.com is so mean!" but there's nothing I can really do about that so I just keep on doing what I do, and that's spend $1000's a month out of my own pocket to run a site where cosplayers can have fun with their hobby, and I can play with lumberjacks once a year.

Cait
04-08-2004, 10:05 AM
0_0 Actually, my sister will get a through beating, now. I'll tell her you posted, though.

Edit: I agree with her, though. *waves flag* Go, sis! And here I thought she'd stopped going here months ago.

Rosiel
04-08-2004, 12:20 PM
0_0 Actually, my sister will get a through beating, now. I'll tell her you posted, though.

Edit: I agree with her, though. *waves flag* Go, sis! And here I thought she'd stopped going here months ago.

As a side note... the person who started the thread can't be a long time poster and your sister, for the only posting account ever associated with that IP is yours, Cait.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do about the site, and especially about myself and the other moderators, but I do wish that instead of writing a long diatribe under a pseudonym you would have PMed Admin to sort things out in private.

Nothing can ever be worked out by lashing out like this.

Cait
04-08-2004, 02:34 PM
-_-" Ok, geniuses. Up until a few months ago I didn't even have that IP address, or I shouldn't have. She stopped posting using the family computer somewhere in the fall or winter of last year. She uses my new machine and new connection, now, primarily to check the All My Children message boards and play The Sims. But, I don't care and you don't care and it doesn't matter. I'd write my own spiel a thousand times more detailed and email it to everyone under the sun if I had any reason to believe that anyone would listen. I don't so I don't. As far as I'm concerned this place is dead to me, and has been for some time, and after this con season I will discontinue my patronage of this place completly. This has become a place that I no longer approve of nor want to be attached to. That's why my sister left, that's why I'm going.

psythe
04-08-2004, 03:06 PM
Buh-Bye Now! :D

K_Valentine
04-08-2004, 04:01 PM
Eh, whoever made the post- whether it was you or your sister or possibly your father's uncle's sister's neighbor's roommate- could have at least stuck with her original screen name instead of hiding behind an entirely new name. If you're going to stand behind your staement, at least claim responsibility for it.

A J
04-08-2004, 06:21 PM
Wow. The number of board members' 'siblings' who post rants that happen to coincide with said board member being peeved is just phenomenal... o_O

Someone should start a study or something.

Romann
04-08-2004, 09:38 PM
Of course, most of our reputation hinges on the hurt feelings of members when other members put them down and is played out in livejournal posts around the world as "cosplay.com is so mean!" but there's nothing I can really do about that so I just keep on doing what I do, and that's spend $1000's a month out of my own pocket to run a site where cosplayers can have fun with their hobby, and I can play with lumberjacks once a year.


IMO, people often complain a lot of what they get for free. No matter what it is. Hell, I'm guilty of it *shrugs* All I can say is thank you for keeping the site free for us ( No, I'm not trying to kiss-ass)

BTW, the banner lumberjack is gone :(

Ambrosia
04-08-2004, 10:02 PM
Of course, most of our reputation hinges on the hurt feelings of members when other members put them down and is played out in livejournal posts around the world as "cosplay.com is so mean!" but there's nothing I can really do about that.
Which is one of the many reasons I abandoned LJ completely. Pointless drama on said topic.

Jen-neko
04-08-2004, 10:54 PM
IMO, the elimination of the off-topic boards has alleviated a LOT of issues--beit in the form of topics or people (one such person who comes to mind, and will remain nameless, generated a lot of problems for a lot of people on said boards not that long ago...). Besides, there's still Non-Cosplay boards, they just don't have to do with mindless babble and the like.

Sorry, but I side with Admin. I may not come here everyday like I used to, but that's not because of the site, it's because of my own life/school/etc. getting in the way. I'll continue to remain loyal as well. Unless, you know, Admin says I have a big butt or something :rolleyes: then I might just be forced to leave! :P

Krishna
04-09-2004, 01:37 AM
What would you like me to wear? I don't cosplay. Everyone wants me to, not out of spite, mind you, but more out of how amusing it would be. I don't need to either, because nothing I do or say would make anyone think I know a thing about cosplaying. I'm a photographer, and I like to photograph cosplayers. My girlfriend loves to cosplay. So we opened this site, for my love of photography and her love of cosplay. And that's as far as I feel the need to explain myself. In fact that is the first time I think anyone has ever even cared, at least publically.
I was just wondering why Admin start this site since he is not a cosplayer... and here is the answer :D Sorry, always curious..... ^^;;;

But anyway, this site have been my one of my favorite site since i joined :D well i noticed it ever since it started... well even like there is some message about it coming soon...there was right...i'm pretty sure there was.... tell me that my memory is still working.. it's gone bad ever since i'm in college now ... -_- (yes i'm wierd.. well actully i was thinking hmm there should be a cosplay.com.. and there it was :D) but didn't join till later... don't remember why.... i actully think it's better that this fourm is more focused on costume part now.. since it is what cosplay all about right :D and i alway love going through the gallery.. see difference cosplayer's new photos :D it's a great place! espeicaly for people like me that haven't get a chance to go to con!

Miyu
04-09-2004, 02:18 AM
oh my SISTER did it! rofl. nice.

i'm sorry, but i really really don't find that convincing at all. if you have an opinion and you decide to speak on it annonymously (so as to not taint your precious social reputation with the very people you're speaking out against, heaven forbid) it makes that opinion of yours difficult to respect or acknowledge. the post was rather well-worded; whether one agrees with it or not.. however, what a shame for you that it won't be taken seriously upon the basis of it's poster being cowardly. <3

Mekou
04-09-2004, 03:46 AM
Since everone is putting in their "IMO's" I think that the topic of this concern should be addressed instead of pointing fingers at who /might/ have posted it. Who cares /who/ posted this! It seems to me that people are just avoiding the the topic..

I only have a complaint about the manor in which duties are carried out. I often seen one liner posts saying "this topic is now closed" and sometimes that is accompanied by a small sarcastic remark. Wouldn't this be considered spam? Why is it that mods are allowed to make these one liner posts while members would/do get in trouble for them? I think it's only fair that mods follow the same rules that they enforce.

It might just be me but often I read mod replies to topic and sometimes they seem...I don't know how to word it without making it sound like an insult (which it is not intended to be). The best way I can describe it is that it seems like the mods are having very bad days and are unconsiously letting it show in what they type. Again, it's probably just the way I see thing that are worded in a certain way. ^^;

Please don't take what I've just said as an insult. Think of it as constructive critisism if you must. =)

With that said, the mods and admin do thier job very well and we are lucky to have people like them who care enough to regularly moderate te board instead of popping in once and a while just to show that they're still alive. They all certainly don't get enough gratitude for what they do for us.

The problem also lies with the members of the board. Far too many people are purposely ignoring the rules and become childishly angry when their thread gets closed or moved for being off-topic. Welcome to the real world folks. Rules are meant to be followed and if you don't follow them then it's your own fault if something happens.

Koumori
04-09-2004, 08:59 AM
-Lots of longtime cosplayers and longtime posters left this board because of the constant inane off-topic babble; if the board had a "former glory," it was before it was hijacked by threads full of posters complaining about their parents and wanting to be told what to wear. Admin, who shouldn't need to remind us that this is HIS board, paid for and maintained BY HIM, took steps to address that problem and try to make this a cosplay-focused site again. I applaud him wholeheartedly for this, and support his right to enforce HIS rules on HIS board. All of the rules he's set up are there for a reason, and I think the board has improved tremendously since their implementation.
-There are many other places on the web where fans and even cosplayers can gather and chatter about whatever strikes their fancy. I support Admin and his staff in their attempts to make cosplay.com a destination for <i>cosplay</i> discussion. No set of rules that he or anybody else sets up is going to make everybody happy all of the time. That's the beauty of the Net: there is always someone who disagrees with you.. and there is always somewhere else to go when a site does not suit your needs.
-Admin has clearly articulated on several occasions his reasons for not permitting discussion of P2P services. There are many other places online to get this information if you want it; there's no reason to try to browbeat him into allowing it on this particular site.
-There is never a need for anonymous posts. Take your concerns directly to the moderators if you want them to be taken seriously.

Eleryth
04-09-2004, 11:42 AM
Figure here might be a good place to post it... on the rules thing. I have no issues with them, except their location. Perhaps a link or notice or something on the first page of the forum (the one you get when clicking forum after typing www.cosplay.com into the url) that says "read the rules here before posting"?
Then no one can claim to have missed them, because it would be very obvious for everyone.

Or, I could just be blind and totally missing the obvious link that's there already, which is most likely the case. Especially when it's 1 am. *sleepy*