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Tigerzeyes
06-04-2006, 01:09 PM
I figured this would be the right place to ask. :)
What can the average cosplayer, aka Me :), expect as a reasonable price for convention professional photography? Because I was thinking it might be a good idea to get my photo taken professionally after all the hard work that goes into a costume... but I don't want to get fleeced.
What do you professional types typically charge for something like that?
How much is too much if I don't know anything about the reputation of the photographer?

If I'm in the wrong place, sorry!

Thanks a lot photo-ey folks!

~Tiger

Shizzo
06-04-2006, 04:01 PM
uggggggggghhhh I just posted a nice reply and it got eaten.

Anway, I've only paid for a photoshoot once. It was with Admin of this site and it was $40 for two people for a half hour of shooting. I'm sure you've seen Admins photo galleries on the main page of cosplay.com, so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect nice photos at a convention for not a lot of money.

A lot of amateur (in name only, not quality) photographers will do a photoshoot with you for free. They get a free model, you get free pictures. Now, if I could only FIND one of these photographers, I'd be thrilled. I am never happy with photos I take of myself.

Really though, you shouldn't have to pay too much. If they want more than you're willing to pay then you can always say no thanks =)

Ami Yuy
06-04-2006, 04:32 PM
Over here on the West coast we've got a gaggle of good photographers that if you know them, you can ask *coughbribecough* them for a shoot and they'll normally agree. ^^ I'm sure there are some regular cosplay photographers that would be willing to do free shoots up there too.

However, if you want to pay, I've never seen over $25 as the base charge of a shoot for one person for 30 mins - 1 hour.

Tigerzeyes
06-04-2006, 05:31 PM
My problem is I live waaaaaay up in norther Ontario... not a super place for... well... anything... lol.
If anyone knows of a good photographer who lives in or near Sudbury ON, ...
Let me know, lol
Or if you guys know of anyone who'll be at Canadian National Anime Expo (Sept. 1-3), you'd be my gods. :)

Thanks for the input,

Tiger

TomodachiFriend
06-04-2006, 08:30 PM
I know it's not a place to ask for photographers and models but I'll answer your last request. :) I think SolarTempest lives in Toronto or somewhere around there. He did some private shoots at AnimeNorth so you could probably book one with him for September. Do this privately though.

staereo
06-04-2006, 08:47 PM
I just worked AB. I was staff, so I did the shoots for free, and if people wanted prints, they paid my expenses for printing.

At a model shoot, or a private photoshoot, it really depends on the rights and releases of the shoot.

If someone is interested in TFP, or TFCD (Time for Prints or Time for CD), I will decide if I think they offer an image Im looking for in my own portfolio. If so, I would agree. (Or if I had a lot of free time.)

If someone is interested in portfolio pictures, with rights for sole use in non profitable self promotion, I will charge a nominal fee for my time, plus cost of prints.

If someone is intereted in rights to their pictures from a shoot, the fee goes up quite a bit. Usually in this case, the cost of the prints or media is included in the shoot price.

You can go from free to 200 an hour for your talented semi professional or professional. Big name photographers clearly dont apply here.

I would say the going rate of $20/30 mins is a good deal.

In a shoot which I gain nothing, I will never shoot for less than I could make hourly working shift.

Bruce

Jersey13
06-04-2006, 09:10 PM
I have a professional photographer friend who I asked about that, and I'm fairly sure his rate is somewhere around $60-$100 / hour. I live in the Balt/Wash area, so I guess it must be a bit more expensive around here than for you guys. Or maybe my friend is just that good. :)

If I get my costume all awesome, I'm gonna see if I can get him to take some photos.

Ami Yuy
06-04-2006, 09:18 PM
I have a professional photographer friend who I asked about that, and I'm fairly sure his rate is somewhere around $60-$100 / hour. I live in the Balt/Wash area, so I guess it must be a bit more expensive around here than for you guys. Or maybe my friend is just that good. :)

If I get my costume all awesome, I'm gonna see if I can get him to take some photos.
Well, the difference for me at least (I charge in the $20 range) is that I try and keep it cheap for cosplayers. Also, since the goal of the pictures is generally just photos for the web, the editing and exporting process is a lot easier, less time consuming, and cheaper than printing.

Now, for regular non-cosplay shoots, I would definately charge more, also depending on what and how many prints.

SolarTempest
06-05-2006, 12:39 AM
I think SolarTempest lives in Toronto or somewhere around there. He did some private shoots at AnimeNorth so you could probably book one with him for September. Do this privately though.
Hahaha, thanks TomodachiFriend. Staying within forum rules, I'll just confirm that I am in the Toronto area and I have done shoots in the Toronto area. =P

I think for Cosplayers, $20 for an hour is quite fair. I don't see most cosplayers being on a huge budget. Many amateur photographers are willing to do longer sessions or for cheaper, notably because most of them just love shooting. Amateur does not mean unskilled, it means it's less than 10% of their annual income.

Jostens (professional portrait company) here charges $80 for ~8 moderate quality and cliche graduation shots. And that's assembly-line photography.

When doing awards dinner / formal photography, I've made $600 profit for a few hours work with my assistant.

Regardless of expertise and job, I think photographers should always recieve some compensation for their work. We all provide skilled work and the equipment is very expensive. Fair pay for fair work, that's what I believe in. I certainly don't expect people to pay me for my photography what I make at work though =P

As for TFP, I'm not a fan. Cosplay/model photography isn't going to be my career so I'm not interested in photos for my portfolio. I'm already spending my time and have paid for my equipment, so unless it's an extremely large opportunity, I'd rather not pay for someone else's prints. Photos downloadable online, I can do that.

And there's never any "quota" for shots. Whatever good shots I take get put out to the model / cosplayer. If the model / cosplayer works quickly and is well prepared, they're rewarded for their efforts. That simple!

Ollie
06-05-2006, 08:14 AM
If you're looking for a photographer (didn't we just have a thread on this?), try your local university art department or photography club. They could probably point you in the right direction to find somebody who'd work with you. Especially if you're just asking for digital copies, there's not much overall cost involved. And art students would probably appriciate the oppertunity to practice on a real model. Just spend some time talking with whomever you end up with so you both know what to expect.

Now, you could also ask photographers at a con. I know DeathCom actually set up a studio and sold prints on site at Tekkoshocon. But anybody at a con may be busy, have obligations, or unwilling for many other reasons. Finding somebody local is a much better bet.

DarkMag
06-05-2006, 03:48 PM
I suggest to everyone to go to www.modelmayhem.com. You have to register and stuff, but you can usually go around looking for photographers that'll do a photoshoot for free around your areaa if you want the TFCD. These photos will help create your portfolio and stuff.

My photographer will be following me around for 4 - 5 hours taking my pics at the Anime Expo for free, so I'm happy about that. =]

JohnThurston
06-12-2006, 12:57 AM
I suggest to everyone to go to www.modelmayhem.com. You have to register and stuff, but you can usually go around looking for photographers that'll do a photoshoot for free around your areaa if you want the TFCD. These photos will help create your portfolio and stuff.

My photographer will be following me around for 4 - 5 hours taking my pics at the Anime Expo for free, so I'm happy about that. =]

This sounds almost too good to be true, so I have some stupid questions:

What does TFCD mean?

I looked around briefly on the site, and kinda got lost... I understand that I'll need to register, but: How does one go about asking for "free"/cheap photographers in their area?

Thanks!

-JT

photoworks.ws
06-12-2006, 03:00 AM
I suggest to everyone to go to www.modelmayhem.com. You have to register and stuff, but you can usually go around looking for photographers that'll do a photoshoot for free around your areaa if you want the TFCD. These photos will help create your portfolio and stuff.
I've seen several cosplay threads on Modelmayhem.com lately. Some people wanting to get together. I used to have an account on OMP but I find the people on MM much friendlier and more reliable about setting stuff up. Feel free to email me if you want any advice about MM.
Curt

photoworks.ws
06-12-2006, 03:07 AM
This sounds almost too good to be true, so I have some stupid questions:

What does TFCD mean?

I looked around briefly on the site, and kinda got lost... I understand that I'll need to register, but: How does one go about asking for "free"/cheap photographers in their area?

TFCD is Time For (images on) CD. It's a trade. If the photographer thinks that shooting you for free will add to their portfolio or provide them with an interesting creative opportunity they may agree to shoot for this trade (your modeling for their images of you). http://www.newmodels.com/ has a section of TFP (prints) and other relevant stuff if you're wanting to hook up with a photographer on MM or OMP. I have a number of links like this on my site ( http://photoworks.ws/links.htm ).

Attractive females with interesting outfits will have the most success in finding trade services. There have been several cosplay threads on MM lately. Just plug "cosplay" into the search engine on MM.

Curt

Jurai
06-12-2006, 05:09 AM
Hi there to all !

I'm a hobby photographer. I spend my time on german conventions and take about 1000 photos per convention. Most of those photos were taken just in time. When i see a cosplayer with a nice costume, i ask him/her about some photos. When i notice, that the cosplayer likes posing, i prefer to make several pics. After convention i publish them on my own website or on a server supported by a big german anime-/manga community.

I do so since 2002. Lots of german cosplayers know my photos and some of them come to me on conventions and ask for a session. I've never taken money for those pics. The reason is, that i don't have lots costs. If i'd have to rent a studio or other technics, I had to take money for that service.

Nobody knows what the future brings. Maybe anytime i'll have to take money.

I don't know much about prices in USA. I guess in Germany you'll pay for an "one our session" much more than 50 Euro. It depence on how many pics the cosplayer wants to have printed.

I wish, that my english were better ... sorry for that :angel:
Greetz Jurai :skidude2:

ZiggyB
06-20-2006, 08:37 PM
Alright folks, this is just a reminder of the forum rules listed here:

http://forums.cosplay.com/showthread.php?t=61143


Working Photographers are welcome and even encouraged to post in here, however, there is absolutely no solicitation in this forum.
This is not a photo shoot scheduling forum. Please do not ask for a photographer, and please do not offer your services as one, for profit or even for free. I will be adding a section to the site in the near future to serve that purpose.
Anything construed as an attempt to gain business will be closed and possibly deleted.
No solicitation of anything, including camera equipment, prints, etc.
No "seeking models", even free models, school projects, casting calls, whatever.


Please keep the discussion general in nature or I'll have to close the thread.

supaaren
06-20-2006, 08:40 PM
aww crap sorry about that *_*

KaosEfx
06-22-2006, 10:45 AM
I hope this doesn't go against the rules, but I have a question....

When photographers get the photoshoots at the con, are they normally responsible for editing them? The only reason I'm asking is because most people like to do their own editing, so if they just get a cd with the pics on them, then they will be happy.

just wondering.

staereo
06-22-2006, 12:25 PM
When photographers get the photoshoots at the con, are they normally responsible for editing them? The only reason I'm asking is because most people like to do their own editing, so if they just get a cd with the pics on them, then they will be happy.

just wondering.

If someone asks for EDITABLE images from me, I will charge SIGNIFICANTLY more. (Many times the amount.) The reason being is that in order to do an independant photoshoot for a set of images with me, the person that is contracting me to do the work is to normally recieve a set of FINALIZED images. This is my art, and for someone to twist and turn it, requires an additional fee or royalty to be made out to me. This INCLUDES, but is not limited to: adding a logo, CG work, retouching, etc. If someone changes the art in which I have created, it is no longer my work alone, and now my name is attached to a piece that I may not have personally approved as a finalized image. So I would charge based on its usage for editing. If I didnt like it, though, I would have my name removed, and the contracting entity would have to pay an amount large enough for me to remove credit to myself, on a piece I created.

In fact, right out of the contract that I use, is this excerpt that refers to modifying images:

"Client will not make or permit any alterations, additions, or subtractions in respect of the photographs, including without limitation any digitalization or synthesizing of the photographs, alone or with any other material, by use of computer or other electronic means or any other method or means now or hereafter known. "

It also refers to the breaching of rights usage if this does occur, and the consequences, and liabilities to the client if such were to happen.

Does this mean I wouldnt consider offering images open to editing? No. But it would have to be negotiated in advance, and the price would be increased significantly, and final approval would have to come from me. I would also charge 2 seperate fees, one for the shoot, and the other for rights. The rights would have a minimum amount, with a variable range, based on accuracy of projected final edit approved once complete.

Bruce

skypirate
06-22-2006, 12:49 PM
When photographers get the photoshoots at the con, are they normally responsible for editing them? The only reason I'm asking is because most people like to do their own editing

The photographer has the exclusive copyright for their images. It is for protecting their livelyhood. They can give, sell or negotiate away those rights if they choose to.

deleriumx
06-22-2006, 05:24 PM
ditto what staereo said. Most people dont think about it this way when asking for a photographer to take pictures of their costumes, but it is an artform. I always have trouble letting someone other than myself edit my photos because, like any other artist, i have a certain style and want that style to remain consistent among my work. Once someone else changes it, it is no longer my vision. I guess you could compare it to a portrait painter. You wouldnt go to a painter and then expect to go home and paint over it the way you would like it to be.

So basically when i shoot someone, it is understood that i will edit them and send them the finalized images. i think most photographers do the same.

Ami Yuy
06-22-2006, 05:42 PM
ditto what staereo said. Most people dont think about it this way when asking for a photographer to take pictures of their costumes, but it is an artform. I always have trouble letting someone other than myself edit my photos because, like any other artist, i have a certain style and want that style to remain consistent among my work. Once someone else changes it, it is no longer my vision. I guess you could compare it to a portrait painter. You wouldnt go to a painter and then expect to go home and paint over it the way you would like it to be.

So basically when i shoot someone, it is understood that i will edit them and send them the finalized images. i think most photographers do the same.
Exactly.

I do know some photographers that if they did a free shoot for their friends they'll give them the pictures, but *shrugs* I don't like doing it, whether it was free or not.

skypirate
06-22-2006, 06:56 PM
I guess you could compare it to a portrait painter. You wouldnt go to a painter and then expect to go home and paint over it the way you would like it to be.

An 'edited' analog painting will only be seen by a handful of people. You've got to figure with cosplay and digital, the target audience is the internet, where the 'edited' work (and your reputation) will be seen by thousands.

And of course, those who feel the need to tamper always apply the gimmicks you wouldn't be caught dead doing.

Eriol
06-23-2006, 12:13 PM
If someone asks for EDITABLE images from me, I will charge SIGNIFICANTLY more. ... (additional contract verbiage)

How do you photographers enforce the contract? If you give your "non-editable" images to a "typical cosplayer," that cosplayer is likely going to modify your image to create a forum avatar or some other purpose. Once an image is on the internet, it can be grabbed by someone else and modified. How do you know if your original image has been modified and how do you determine who modified it?

staereo
06-23-2006, 01:02 PM
How do you know if your original image has been modified and how do you determine who modified it?

People have done it, and they continue to do it. People on this very forum have taken my images and changed them. Ultimately it comes down to rights. If I havent given someone rights to do so, I decide if it's worth my effort, based on what's being done with it.

My images are registed with the copyright office, and the raws hold the serial number to my camera, raws which only I have.

If I choose to, I will have my lawyer, who I have on retainer at this very moment, send a message on letterhead to the individual. If they comply, it ends. If they do not, I pursue legal action.

If I know someone was innocent in intentions thats one thing. But the people that have done it here, for example, I have signatures from them saying that they WOULDNT do just that. So it would be very easy in civil court to prevail.

If I never ever find out an image is being exploited, is it really hurting me financially?

Bruce

EDIT:=> In answer to who modified it, it doesnt matter. One person signs a contract for a set of pictures. That person will be the person I pursue first. Its making sure you have accountability of where your pictures go when they originally leave your hands. Those people sign contracts that explicitly spell out what rights to publish (including online) they are given. If it's in someone's hands that wasn't in the contract, you know who had to give them out to begin with. My contracts also state clearly damages for this action.

If it continues out of their hands, I continue mailing bills to each hand I find it in for the same damages (cost) for them to publish my work, at a rate for publishing my work without asking me first. Yay. More money. Most publishers are happy to pay out when they found out they 'oooopsed'. Easier and cheaper, and more successful than a civil suit. Copyright law in the last 20 years has greatly favored the artist/author.

Eriol
06-23-2006, 02:06 PM
My images are registed with the copyright office, and the raws hold the serial number to my camera, raws which only I have.

Aren't images you give to clients converted to something other than raw? Is there a unique identifier in JPEGs, for example?

Also, do you register every, single image with the copyright office? You probably take hundreds of photos.

staereo
06-23-2006, 03:11 PM
Aren't images you give to clients converted to something other than raw?

You bet. Depending on the client's need, I typically use TIF (8 or 16b) and JPEG.

Is there a unique identifier in JPEGs, for example?

Yes there are. You're absolutely right. If you choose to convert and save the metadata, this data and the added 'Copyright: Bruce OBryan' data would both be found in the image metadata. Many people that use the image would never think about this, and it would be left in there for anyone to view. But some people choose to be very devious and remove this data on purpose. Whats important is that you have the original RAW file with this data, which makes it easy to prove that the lesser-quality digital image was produced by the RAW file that you, and you alone hold.

Also, do you register every, single image with the copyright office? You probably take hundreds of photos.

You're absolutely right again. My AB shoot yielded nearly 2,000 shots. Of those, under 700 are ever going to leave my hands. Now, when I publish these photos, and send the images on CD/DVD to Anime Boston for their publicity usage, I will also send the same images to the copyright office. You needn't include full resolution copies. As long as you mail the form to the copyright office BEFORE publication, you need only send 1 set of low res images or a proof sheet(s) to be copyrighted. Your form and $30 ($45 after july 1st, i think) covers 1 submission. That means all of my images on disc are stamped as 1 submission and 1 copyright date. So I will cover all 700ish pictures with that one submission. Much easier than you'd think, eh?

Now, the copyright is timestamped as soon as it is recieved by the office, even though it can take months to process. So you're covered as soon as they open it.

Also, they do not need to be retouched or anything, so many photographers burn a quick CD or print a proof sheet as soon as they are done shooting, and send it right out, before even deciding on pics to toss, or retouch.

:bigtu:
Bruce

Edit: Helpful link for people that want to copyright their photography: http://www.copyright.gov/register/visual.html

Eriol
06-23-2006, 05:08 PM
Yes there are. You're absolutely right. If you choose to convert and save the metadata, this data and the added 'Copyright: Bruce OBryan' data would both be found in the image metadata.

Is this the comment field that most DSLR's provide? My Nikon D50 has the ability to attach a comment to all shots taken. I can put 30 characters into that field, which is enough to put a (C) symbol with name and some other identifier. It will add that information to my JPEGs, not just RAW.

But some people choose to be very devious and remove this data on purpose. Whats important is that you have the original RAW file with this data, which makes it easy to prove that the lesser-quality digital image was produced by the RAW file that you, and you alone hold.

Ok, I see how you can make a case that someone has violated your contract.


Your form and $30 ($45 after july 1st, i think) covers 1 submission. That means all of my images on disc are stamped as 1 submission and 1 copyright date. So I will cover all 700ish pictures with that one submission. Much easier than you'd think, eh?

OH! I thought each image need to be copyrighted...that would have been 700x$30...which is a lot more expensive than a single CD submission full of images.

One other question I wanted to ask: what kind of attorney do you need to help you enforce contracts and copyright? Is there a law specialty photographers should look for in a lawyer? In other words, I don't think I want to go to a personal injury lawyer to enforce contracts and copyright since that would not be the lawyer's specialty.

Zetchi
06-24-2006, 01:10 AM
Some of the people I know around here do it for free. I can't imagine someone paying over $40 for a shoot though. Well I wouldn't personally. But then again, ti depends on their creditentials.

staereo
06-24-2006, 06:07 AM
One other question I wanted to ask: what kind of attorney do you need to help you enforce contracts and copyright? Is there a law specialty photographers should look for in a lawyer? In other words, I don't think I want to go to a personal injury lawyer to enforce contracts and copyright since that would not be the lawyer's specialty.

Intellectual property legislation or corporate law are two favorable specialties of a lawyer you would want to go for regarding copyright law. Not to mention, there are actual 'copyright' attorneys out there. They even have 'internet' attorneys now.

Ultimately though, it depends on your flow, and your financial input. If you trust a personal lawyer to be smart enough to do the research involved to protect your rights, and you arent making a living from your images (or maybe a small, one person outfit) it may be fine to trust your personal lawyer to handle the job. That depends on how well you know your lawyer, I suppose.

Bruce

KaosEfx
06-24-2006, 11:12 AM
when I was talking about editing, I mainly ment cropping/retouching. I was asking because I would figure that a lot of people would want their pics within the time frame of the con, so simple resizing, cropping, and retouching wouldn't be that big of a deal.

staereo
06-24-2006, 11:53 AM
when I was talking about editing, I mainly ment cropping/retouching. I was asking because I would figure that a lot of people would want their pics within the time frame of the con, so simple resizing, cropping, and retouching wouldn't be that big of a deal.

I totally know what you mean. But those points remain in tact.

The moment you clean a blemish, you change the image from its intended output from the artist that created it, and have taken their art and changed it.

I'm not sure what you meant about the time frame of a con. If I do a photo shoot for someone at a con, I assume that involved in that photoshoot is complete retouching, etc. And I have a pretty fast turnaround for individual shoots.

You don't walk away from most shoots with 2,000 images. Usually only a couple hundred from a LONG shoot.

Those get boiled down to a tenth that, maybe 30 or so that are 'saleable' quality. So in reality, you're only dealing with the retouching of 30 pictures. If you take 10-15 minutes on each one, you're looking at less than a days work. If a model/cosplayer would like you to be a little more aggressive with the photos, and... say... shrink a belly, firm a tush, shape a chest, etc... then one would expect it to be a little more time intensive.

At AB I offered at-con proof printing. I may not do this again, as it was a time hogger.

Someone can expect a quality picture from a photographer, thats fine. Someone can expect that picture in a short amount of time. Someone can also expect retouching to make them look better than real life. But you can't expect a retouched copy immediatly.

I would also say that most photographers would be happy to part with a full res digital image for the client to retouch. Expect the value to be triple the fee of a full res digital image to allow the retouching, and expect a full res digital image to run you easily over 100 dollars for a single con shot. (Assuming it was a photo shoot done for you with non exlcusive rights only to publish in self promoting fashion (your OWN gallery, without profit directly from image), without rights to redistribute, and at a limited resolution online.)

That will be probably $300.00 per image at full res with rights to edit. If you do 30 shots 'saleable', and you choose to take all 30, you're looking at a sweet $9000.00 for the images from the shoot.

Worth it? I wouldnt say so. Would you find people happy to do it for free? Probably. But I think this question is aimed at photographers that either make a living doing photography (pro), make money doing photography (semi pro), or have an interest as photography as their form of artistic self expression (amateur).

If you're looking for great quality, it is typical that the photographer will fit into one of those three groups. If they fit in one of those three groups, their willingness to allow their art to be touched for less than I say here is slim to none, unless you know them personally and get favors as friends.

Now, a smarter idea, to get an image just how you want, is to ask if you can have certain things done. I would happily attempt to make my client happy by editing it in such a way they would desire. I wouldnt mind if a picture got sent back and forth a few times to fine tune it either. If it wasnt much work, I may not even charge for it. If it were intensive, I may, but it would still be a small, nominal fee, especially in comparison to the fees I just offered here for editable images. It would be much less, because I would KNOW it was leaving my hands as MY art.

Bruce

KaosEfx
06-24-2006, 12:41 PM
Wow! That was a lot of freakin information! lol. When I was talking about the timeframe of the con, I was mainly saying that if I took some photos on Saturday, they would have them on CD on Sunday before they left.

I've been thinking about getting into con photography as I get more into my camera and learning specific settings for outdoors and stuff. So that was my concern.

staereo
06-24-2006, 12:53 PM
Wow! That was a lot of freakin information! lol. When I was talking about the timeframe of the con, I was mainly saying that if I took some photos on Saturday, they would have them on CD on Sunday before they left.

I've been thinking about getting into con photography as I get more into my camera and learning specific settings for outdoors and stuff. So that was my concern.

Ahhhh.. Yes, then what you'll probably sell is unretouched prints. Those can be done fairly quickly. I would say a given image took 10 minutes of my time to have print ready.

If youre printing at high quality (say, 2-300dpi) realize that people will be bold enough to digitize (via scan) your images and edit them, add logos, etc. Make sure you have them sign agreements prohibiting it, just to give yourself leverage.

I usually had prints ready in 4-6 hours from time of capture.

Make sure you have an assistant.

If youre leaving them on CD, you could easily have them ready in an hour, with an assistant, even when shooting throughout the hour.

Be VERY VERY careful with offering full res digital images.

Bruce

Fighterspledge
07-06-2006, 02:07 PM
I've learned quite a bit about alot of stuff just from this thread and it's making my head spin haha. It's talked about what the average charge is for photoshoots, to the legal aspects and the ethics of photogenic artwork ownership. Perhaps I'll be falling under the amateurish/semi-pro aspect of a photograpgher?

If it was me at the level I was in right now, I think I would just be willing to trade pics in thanks for having a model to take pictures of. But as I build experience and equipment, I would like to start charging since I think it takes quite a bit of personal time to do touch ups, at least it takes me quite some time haha.

I know I won't be living on my photo skills, but I do want to look into publishing later down in the future and I definately want to learn more about the business side of photograpghy along with the art. Is there a place you can point me to learn about this kind of stuff? Because I know there is some leagal aspect to taking pics, some kind of release form to allow you to use the images for whatever reason and other aspects that I'm a bit shady on but would definately like to know more about.

staereo
07-06-2006, 03:06 PM
At this point in your photography, you want to do a search on "TFP" which stands for "Time For Prints" (Also TFCD, TFDVD, etc).

There are specific releases that allow you to exchange your time as a photographer, and prints, for a model's time and image as a model. A TFP/CD/DVD release (Usually just called TFP release) allows both you and the model equal rights to use the image in portfolios and non profitable self promotion. (Cant sell images, neither party.)

Ultimately you will retain ownership of the images, but the model will have rights to publish the images in self promotion as well. (And you can do the same.)

So, do a search of TFP releases, and TFP. That will get you information on shooting models in a time-for-prints setting.

As far as the business end, I have a myriad of links. Typically forums specifically about photography have a lot of focus on the business end of it.

If you have any specific questions, youre welcome to ask.

Bruce

Fighterspledge
07-07-2006, 12:31 PM
Please! Can you PM me some good references and links? I would greatly appreciate it. You have some pretty extensive knowledge and I would love to pick up on it. Do you do your own publishing as well?

Eriol
07-07-2006, 04:13 PM
Staereo, I'd be interested in reading the links about the business end of photography also.

staereo
07-07-2006, 04:15 PM
Alright guys... Ill post some links here over the course of the weekend. At this point I'm pretty worn out, but I should have plenty of time to go about it this weekend.

staereo
07-10-2006, 08:03 PM
Ugh... I just typed some out and linked out of this page.

Anyways, long story short, I've got a lot more going on this week than I planned. So my apologies for a shorter list than I had planned to give, and also for a littler later than intended.

John Harrington is a pro photographer from DC, and his business sense is masterful. He is very open on his site, and it is great to just browse the business aspects. Im pretty sure he does seminars, and if he did one around here, i'd definately be there. http://www.johnharrington.com/

Good release info:
http://www.danheller.com/model-release.html

Good general info:
http://www.nppa.org/
http://www.asmp.org/
http://photographersindex.com/

Also, go to the forums over at http://www.fredmiranda.com/

There is sooooo much great information there, not to mention links, reviews, and the like. Theres a LOT of professionals that are there, and many people that I truely admire and request advice from. I strongly suggest registering there and joining the forums.

That will get you started. Please feel free to email me at bruce at bruceobryan dot com, or PM me for links on a directed subject, as I dont want to steer the subject away from the OP's topic any further than we already have. ^.~

Bruce