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[rubyspitfire]

Originally Posted by Kama

LithiumFlower -I will steal what you said as my opinion too. Going into college I was all excited about Women's Studies. I even declared that as my minor. My first class made me see things differently and was really interesting.

...but then as I got more into it I realized that I couldn't do it. I'm a very "traditional" woman. Not because someone made me be, but because I enjoy things like pretty dresses and make-up and sewing and cooking. Apparently this makes me an inferior woman. When we did the Vagina Monologues, my professor actually made a sneering comment because I chose to wear heels to dress up. She saw me at a fundraiser where I was wearing a slinkier dress and laughed at that too (she was wearing a pants suit).

Feminism is about choice. It's about putting everyone on equal footing. But I think the feminist movement has alienated a lot of women by not respecting like they have the right to wear pants and have short hair and not wear cosmetics, women also have the right to do all those things without being shit on by them.

And this is why I got a less than stellar grade in Women's Poetry. I just couldn't BS my feelings enough to pretend that every woman poet ever was amazing and of course everything they wrote should have impact on my day to day life.

that's a huge reason why i said what i said earlier about not being one. i can't stand people who claim to be part of a group that should be positive and upbuilding putting down someone else who doesn't fit their image (that's why i quit going to church too!). i have a feeling a bunch of women from this site would be all over your professor for that kind of behavior

[Lithium Flower]

Originally Posted by Flora88

Fuck your professor. She's doin' it wrong.

^This part.

That's the kind of femnazi that draws people like you and I away from feminism. At the core feminism is about equal rights and many women will shout that they should be free to be a 'real woman' and who they want to be. But if feeling like a 'real woman' to someone means heals and mascara then by gosh they're just stuck in the 50's and those silly women need to be taught about football and pantsuits!

[sam vimes]

I'm a feminist.

[Kama]

Yeah, pretty much. Lots of people think she's nuts and it makes me sad that the women's studies program (and lots of other) have such a bad reputation because of people like her.I feel like with this, as with anything, if you go automatically to the extreme then people dismiss you because they don't agree with whatever extreme thing you're pressing. Instead of making the logical point "Women shouldn't have to adhere to what society says is feminine" it's like it jumps to "Women shouldn't ever remotely enjoy what society says is feminine or they are traitors to the cause".

The final straw was when I needed hours to graduate on time and the head of the department told me that none of my other classes were approached from a "woman friendly" angle and thus she wouldn't allow any of them to count toward her program. Unfortunately for her I went to my major department head, got the hours, and reported her to the dean for being unhelpfully batshit. In more technical terms.

Originally Posted by sam vimes

I'm a feminist.

Good for you. There were two boys in our class and they were awkward as hell saying that.

[Flora88]

Originally Posted by sam vimes

I'm a feminist.

Like.

[The Hag]

Originally Posted by rubyspitfire

ok, according to that definition i am. i'm not a bra-burning man-hater that a lot of feminists make themselves (and others) out to be

For the record - the Women's Rights movement in the late 60's early 70's never burned their bras. It was a myth started and circulated by the media. Well color me surprised! I highly recommend this entertaining book by Gail Collins - When Everything Changed.

Originally Posted by Lithium Flower

I think my major issue with a lot of feminists I've met has been they view women who chose to be stay at home mothers, single mothers, or have children in general as somehow the opposite of feminism and makes them a bad person.

For the record - I have been both a working mother and a stay-at-home mother. You get an equal amount of shit thrown on you either way. If you work, you're an emasculating shrew and a BAD MOM. If you stay home you're a willing slave to the patriarchy or a gold-digger. Oh what-the-fuck-ever. Seriously - no matter what you do some faction of society will criticize so you might as well do what's best for you and your family.

Something that I think gets overlooked a lot though is that many women with children work, not to prove a point or express themselves, but to ensure their financial independence. If you grow up in a household where your mother is trapped in a hideous marriage because she doesn't know how she'll feed you and your siblings if she packs everyone up and leaves - well, you're pretty damn motivated avoid that situation yourself. And then of course there are all the mothers who have no choice but to work because it's damn hard to get by on one income.

Originally Posted by nannyogg

Extremism, on either end of the spectrum, isn't good for anybody.

While I agree for the most part, I do feel that occasionally you need to behave badly just to get people to even acknowledge that there is a problem. Generally, the only people willing to do that are the extremists. Certainly I'm not advocating violence, but a little civil disobedience isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Originally Posted by sam vimes

I'm a feminist.

SV is the most awesome man I know that I'm not married to.

[DireKitty]

Well I suppose i'm a feminist... but that term feels like a used tampon to me.

/frown

Some people ruin it for everyone.

[penny_dreadful]

Originally Posted by sam vimes

I'm a feminist.

Originally Posted by The Hag

For the record - the Women's Rights movement in the late 60's early 70's never burned their bras. It was a myth started and circulated by the media. Well color me surprised! I highly recommend this entertaining book by Gail Collins - When Everything Changed.

For the record - I have been both a working mother and a stay-at-home mother. You get an equal amount of shit thrown on you either way. If you work, you're an emasculating shrew and a BAD MOM. If you stay home you're a willing slave to the patriarchy or a gold-digger. Oh what-the-fuck-ever. Seriously - no matter what you do some faction of society will criticize so you might as well do what's best for you and your family.

Something that I think gets overlooked a lot though is that many women with children work, not to prove a point or express themselves, but to ensure their financial independence. If you grow up in a household where your mother is trapped in a hideous marriage because she doesn't know how she'll feed you and your siblings if she packs everyone up and leaves - well, you're pretty damn motivated avoid that situation yourself. And then of course there are all the mothers who have no choice but to work because it's damn hard to get by on one income.

While I agree for the most part, I do feel that occasionally you need to behave badly just to get people to even acknowledge that there is a problem. Generally, the only people willing to do that are the extremists. Certainly I'm not advocating violence, but a little civil disobedience isn't necessarily a bad thing.

SV is the most awesome man I know that I'm not married to.

Agreed with all the above, except I am married to SV. I was going to mention the bra-burning part, too, but never got around to it. A lot of the bad press feminists get, when you think about it, is sort of engineered to defame the movement and make it seem like we're all a bunch of unhinged harpies. I BLAME THE PATRIARCHY.

Originally Posted by DireKitty

Well I suppose i'm a feminist... but that term feels like a used tampon to me.

/frown

Some people ruin it for everyone.

If more people adopted the feminist mantle and were willing to wear it proudly, to demonstrate that we're actually just normal people who think women deserve the same rights and respect that men get, it wouldn't sound like such a dirty word anymore.

[Shana05]

Originally Posted by rubyspitfire

ok, according to that definition i am. i'm not a bra-burning man-hater that a lot of feminists make themselves (and others) out to be

For the record, bra burning never happened. In the 70s a group of feminists protested the Miss America pageant. They weren't allowed to start a fire so they just put their bras (among other things) in the trash can as part of their demonstration.

[sam vimes]

Originally Posted by DireKitty

Well I suppose i'm a feminist... but that term feels like a used tampon to me.

/frown

Some people ruin it for everyone.

That's like not being against animal cruelty because you can't stand PETA.

[leeleeleelee]

Yeah, even as a vegetarian and animal rights activist, I can't stand PETA at times. Their crusade against milk, college mascots, and fishing is insane to me.

[nannyogg]

Originally Posted by Flora88

Fuck your professor. She's doin' it wrong.

Yah... that prof is what I would call a "feminazi." They give feminism a bad name.

[penny_dreadful]

So I just heard one of the arguments used by the defense for those two NYC cops acquitted of raping a woman was that "her cervix could have been bruised by washing too vigorously in the shower".

Cervix. Bruised. In. Shower.

Did anyone in that courtroom have any idea how female anatomy works? All my rage. All my effin' rage.

EDIT: Meant to post this in the "current events" thread. Too raged out to notice.

[Lithium Flower]

Originally Posted by penny_dreadful

So I just heard one of the arguments used by the defense for those two NYC cops acquitted of raping a woman was that "her cervix could have been bruised by washing too vigorously in the shower".

Cervix. Bruised. In. Shower.

Did anyone in that courtroom have any idea how female anatomy works? All my rage. All my effin' rage.

EDIT: Meant to post this in the "current events" thread. Too raged out to notice.

....I am not sure if I am cleaning my vagina the right way because I don't recall washing in any manner where my cervix could have ever been bruised.

Do some men really think that we put our whole fist up our vaginerz with a wash cloth or something?

Is there a little vagina gnome that comes in to the shower with us?

[sam vimes]

Wait, which thread is this again? It always boils to vaginas in this place. Cheezus.