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Unread 10-03-2007, 07:23 PM   #46
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>> Is it the music? presentation? poses, what?

It's everything. A confident presentation, with poses that show off all sides of the costumes, along with music that fits the presentation.

>> Also, since you can only participate in one catagory, what do they expect (any con at this point) when it comes to craftsmanship? Well constructed, looks good, combination of the two? Does presentation (your performance) help in the judging of that catagory?

Craftsmanship (which around here we call workmanship, but it's the name thing. ^_^) is judging is different depending on the entry level. If you're a novice they expect that you have basic sewing skills and anything more is just a bonus. If you're a master you're expected to have much more advanced sewing skills.

However, I can say that for any level that workmanship should look good on the inside and outside. So yes, ti's a bombination of the two.

And no, presentation usually doesn't have anything to do with your score on workmanship. But how your costume looks on stage does count towards your overall presentation. ^^

Hope that answers your questions better. D:

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Unread 10-12-2007, 12:50 AM   #47
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OKay... I want (Well, need. I'm not in a cosplay group) to do a walk-on for my Clopin Costume when I finish it, but I'm having some troubles with figuring out some in character things for him. I LOVE the character, but his persona just seems to evade me.
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Unread 10-21-2007, 01:27 AM   #48
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I really just have to open up with how inspiring I find this thread. For someone that has been sewing since I can practically walk but has only just realized how fullfilling costuming or cosplay can be the ideals here are seriously the kind that leave the lay man wanting to take the ideals here to heart and help raise the bar so to speak.

My two cents after all this discussion as is follows.... The one topic that I have not seen formally adressed is how much the cosplayer should be held accountable. Trying to please everyone is never going to set high standards. From years of experice in organizing 4-H juding I am amazed by the masq experience I've had at anime conventions. Frankely we always ran our scheduel tight with near a hundred entires competing. But there was always the underlying objective of offering learning oppertunites and a sort of do or die attitue. By that I mean either you follow are rules or there is the door. We never had a problem with booting people who didn't show up on time. Naturally they had at least six months to plan for judging. And final sign up for judging time was a month in advance. However I think it is the principle that is imporant.

We care so you should care. There was always a bad apple or two who cried foul about the judging. But in my expirence the set up we made of the judges having time to judge and have breaks left a postive atmoshpere for both the judges and the judgees... It also allowed time for feed back. Another important aspect that I feel is missing from Cosplay judging.

Direct feedback from the judges and fellow intrentants spells out exactly what can be done better and why. Weither it be in the interview process or in the presentation. If people do not have any clue what they are doing wrong they are not likely to change. And frankely not everyone is likely to lurk on forums or attend well run panels.

In conclusion I think that the judging process it's self needs to be examined. It will be impossible to raise the bar among cosplayers if there is not a source of direct feed back after judging. In 4-H judging (which was entirely workmanship based) entrants recieved their judging sheets afterwards. Perhaps this is an options. Perhaps judges should give feedback as they interview. Either way without a strong voice saying this is good or this can be done better, I am not sure such a young group will improve. Never mind the improtance of teaching constructive criticism to the younger generation.
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Unread 10-21-2007, 09:07 PM   #49
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I'm all for feedback, yes, but the problem is, judging is usually tight for time as it is. Plus, I wouldn't feel comfortable giving feedback right in that moment because we haven't seen all the entrants yet and can't suggest to one person what they could do to be better. If they end up being the best in show, then what can you say? I don't like to try to tell someone how to improve until I've seen the entire field and can think back, "hm, if that one had just fit her bodice better, she might have gotten higher marks than I gave her." Not to mention, the marks are somewhat arbitrary in the moment, they only have relevence in context - that is, compared to the entire field.

What works best in cosplay is to have a panel the next day - or even a party after the masquerade, I've heard some cons do that - where people can go up to judges privately and ask for specific tips to help them out. By then, everyone, both judges and entrants, have had the time to process, compare, and let any emotions settle down, so no one gets touchy about being told why they didn't measure up. Even if the judge is tactful about it, when emotions are running high during the competition, people dont' take it the right way. But in an "afterglow" panel, or "post mortem" they're sometimes called, it's a good time for the judges and director to receive feedback to improve the masquerade on their end, and then they get to help people individually if they so ask.
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Unread 10-24-2007, 05:32 PM   #50
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wow...I didn't know much about walk-ons until I read these posts. Neat ideas. I'm not sure what I'm gonna do for my first con. I don't know how many of my friends want to do a skit, so I was thinking if I couldn't do a skit I'd try to do a walk-on. All these posts have certainly inspired me.
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Unread 10-27-2007, 04:20 PM   #51
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You can always walk on with a map and confused look. Act like you are lost from whatever anime/game you're from,and give the audience a suprised look. Just throwing that out there.
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Unread 11-18-2007, 09:01 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Angie View Post
Well, now I gave AX a skit proposal, and to my dismay I am standby #8. I wish people understood how a well-done, and may I say NEVER done, costume does not need a skit to be amazing. Everyone here understands that. Maybe next year I can present Dark Knight Rikku. Thanks again everyone!
I bet your costume would have been awsome! This make me want to go to AX even less.You should come over to the fanime next year!
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Unread 11-18-2007, 09:38 PM   #53
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I'm not sure walk ons should be included in every masquerade. Even dynamic posing set to engaging music is not as entertaining compared to most skits. Unfortunately walk ons are often treated as extra filler if there aren't enough other acts.

I know it's hard to take, and you might really want a chance to wear your costume in the spotlight infront of everyone. It's just hard to please everyone and the spots are always limited for these sorts of things. Lots of people get turned away from masquerades as they become more and more popular. If you're not performing then it's seen as a waste of the audiences time. They didn't line up for hours to watch a cosplay fashion show, they came for the skits.

Some cons actually have alternative events like cosplay fashion shows now that focus on the costumes and presentation posing over anything else. Some also have hall costume contests that focus their judging soely on workmanship. Personally I prefer hall costuming because that way people can walk up and see the details and hard work on my outfits all day long instead of for thirty seconds on stage from 100 feet away.

I think you should take a more positive attitude about this and enter your costume in something else. If you don't have a skit or other performance planned out well, then leave the masquerade to those who do. I'm sure there must be lots of other ways you can showcase your talent and gain recognition.
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Unread 11-18-2007, 10:27 PM   #54
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I cannot disagree more, Novaraven. Not everybody goes only to see skits, and quite frankly from my personal experience (having both seen and judged many masquerades) skits are not always good. In fact, really great skits are pretty rare. It's a fact that the more people you have to organize, the more things can go wrong. MOST skits tend to be merely tolerable at best, for various reasons - not well-planned, too many in-jokes, bad sound, goes on too long, ruined by a bad/nonsensical ending, etc.

I do NOT support the attitude that if someone doesn't have a multi-person skit then they don't belong onstage. I've seen many powerful, impressive solo presentations that were miles ahead of most skits. There are of course stand-out examples in both types, but to say that walk-ons are always boring is as bad as saying that skits are always too long and stupid. Both can be true sometimes, but not always.

If people want to see a show comprised of nothing but people going onstage and trying to do bad comedy, they should stick to their highschool talent shows. Masquerades are, as far as I know, still about COSTUMES to some degree. Skits should work together with the costumes to create a full presentation, and just because someone doesn't have a group doesn't mean they shouldn't be able to show off their hard work onstage in a dramatic, impressive fashion (rather than just a runway-style fashion show).
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Unread 11-19-2007, 06:32 AM   #55
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novaraven1 - I completely agree with Sarcasm-hime. There are good performances and "meh" performances. And, honestly, is there really a huge difference between a one or two-person walk-on with music and staging and a three-person "skit"? Many, many suggestions have been made and much discussion has gone on about the "best" way to run a masquerade. And of course, there is no one single answer. If you haven't already, you might want to read through this thread http://forums.cosplay.com/showthread.php?t=114020 (long though it is) which is full of interesting and well-articulated view points on the subject.

P.S. Novaraven - Since this thread is specifically for discussing walk-ons for people who have already decided that they want to do a walk-on, if you want to continue a discussion on skits vs. walk-ons, it would be best to post in the thread I already mentioned.

Last edited by The Hag : 11-19-2007 at 04:43 PM. Reason: to try to stay on-topic
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Unread 11-19-2007, 11:18 AM   #56
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Okay, I've been to almost two dozen cosplay shows now and seen dozens more online and I cannot possibly disagree more with Novaraven.

Fact of the matter is, the Audience (nine times out of ten, anyways) is WAY more into Walk-Ons than skits, mostly because it's not difficult for a skit to fall flat on it's face whereas even a weak walk on can garner a lot of attention if it is from a popular fandom or an eye catching outfit. It's EASIER to get a positive audience reaction with a walk on.

This is not just opinion, this is researched fact.
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Unread 11-19-2007, 10:16 PM   #57
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I guess I don't really have anything to say except...ditto sarcasm-hime, Hag, and Danziku. Unfortunately for novaraven, the OP isn't relevant to the rest of the thread anymore, there's no sense trying to advise someone on something that is over with. We're discussing improving walk-ons so people see them as legitimate performance and art, not whether or not the OP should enter the AX masq as a walk-on anymore.

But saying "people only go for skits" is crazy. They don't. I hear more people *complain* about the lame skits than anything else. Not that anecdotal evidence is going to support either side. Just because you've gotten one impression from the audience at the cons you go to and I get the opposite impression from the cons I go to doesn't mean that either of us is right. It's simply misleading to go and tell someone not to enter competition because they can't do a skit. FAR from it. A lot of masquerade audiences have been totally fooled into loving a performance and never stopped to realize that it wasn't a "skit" per se. They will love what you give them, not what they're expecting.
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Unread 12-07-2007, 11:17 AM   #58
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Could anyone help me? It's not really about a walk on, more about posing in character really...

For my character, people usually expect grins and stuff, but when I smile, I just look dmb -___- Smirking- I'm a master at, but smileys are no no...

I REALLY don't wanna change my cosplay, so you think you guys can help?

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Unread 12-07-2007, 02:45 PM   #59
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Practice in a mirror. Honestly, it's pretty likely you're just being overcritical of yourself. Remember that what looks dumb to you might not look dumb to other people. The more you practice, the more natural it will feel and look.

Also, on a personal note, only having one kind of smile is kinda unfortunate. Broaden your horizons!
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Unread 12-08-2007, 05:53 AM   #60
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I wouldn't worry too much about your smile for the masq. Whether or not your teeth are showing such and such amount won't be that visible a few rows back. All I say is smile very broadly, since after a few rows, your face is like a blob.

But I'm also one of those people who doesn't believe cosplayers should "pose for the camera" on stage. That's what the rest of the con is for; this is the masq and is meant to keep the audience happy.

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