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[ChrowX]

Originally Posted by StraitJacket

.... Damn looks like the idea died... get to expensive or something??? last post is in november of 08 and its now July of 09 lol damn was realy hopeing to find someone with some AT's or someone that was still working on making some lol

One might argue that the project never got off the ground. Like me for instance, I would argue that. While Chris-Chan and Q-Tron were very ambitious and dedicated they never made so much as a pair of Inline Skates, let alone motorized ones.

So, the same rhetoric as usual: The parts don't exist, the materials don't exist, and there is certainly no one on this board with enough mechanical and electrical know-how to pull off something that even comes close to what Air Trecks are supposed to be able to do. Though, it would be nice if something did actually come from this, it hasn't yet.

[Xyphix]

Ok. I'm pretty sure it's about damn time to get this thing back up. It's been 5 years since Q-tron posted this thread and it was attempted by everyone here, except for ChrowX who's been flaming that this is "impossible" with modern technology from 09, for 2 straight years. It's been 3 years since you guys gave up, so im sure technology has advanced enough to make NON-MOTORIZED skates that LOOK like ATs, and AFTER that's been done, THEN I'm sure you guys could find a way to make them motorized. I found this picture of some wheels someone drew on their perspective of the motors FOR THE WHEELS. Sadly it doesn't show anything that's inside the black casing up in the upper left corner
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1983/at1clat.jpg

All I have to say is that if you DON'T think that this is possible, don't say that it cannot be done, or in other words, DON'T FLAME! Dreams are meant to be followed until the DREAMER feels that it's impossible OR if it comes true. Not for someone else to decide.

[verdatum]

I don't think anyone has ever said there were issues making non-motorized ATs. Such is just an issue of development time and money.

As far as I know, the issues in making motorized ATs are the same as they were 4 years ago. You can probably make something decent if you don't mind wearing a backpack with a very heavy battery and conceal a wire running from the backpack to the shoe inside your pants. This kind of technology moves pretty slow. That's why we don't have flying cars and personal jetpacks, even though prototypes have been around for something like 50 years.

[Xyphix]

Here's a thought. I don't know if it's possible, but I DO know that it hasn't been suggested.

Is it at all possible to turn Thermal Energy into Electric Energy? If so then there's your "on the move recharging" issue. Batteries get hot after a while of use, a pressure plate could be used to close the circut* to start the ATs, turning Electric Energy into Kinetic Energy, and if it's possible to turn Thermal Energy, while still being in a compact space if possible, then you can use that to recharge the batteries for a recharged Electric Energy, allowing more/longer Kinetic Energy.

Before people brutally criticize* me, I will admit, I have absolutly NO idea about ANY type of electical/mechanical work. This is just a suggestion with what I've read on here and the problems that have been brought up. I do, however, appreciate any information on any problems with my suggestion

Note: * are put after the words of which I am pretty sure I mis-spelled.

[verdatum]

You'll be pleased to know that it isn't a stupid question.

Yes, it is possible to turn thermal energy into electric energy. With high temperatures, this is done by using the heat to boil water, and use the resultant steam pressure to spin a turbine, which moves a bunch of magnets around, resulting in electricity. This is how most power plants (nuclear, coal, garbage incinerators) work.

The difficulty is in extracting power from heat sources that are below the boiling point of water. The most common way to do this is a device called a Stirling Engine. They actually create motion in the presence of any temperature gradient. A hot cup of coffee works just as well as a glass of iced tea.

There are lots of problems though. You need the stirling engine itself, you need a heat sink on your battery (your heat source) and a radiator on the other side (your cold source). This adds both bulk and weight. It is hard to get much torque with stirling engines, and torque is needed to make the generator turn. The solution is to use a very weak generator (wussier magnets), but the result is much less power generated. With smaller temperature gradients, as would be the case here, you get lower efficiency. Even if very well designed, the engine's efficiency would be somewhere between 0 and 15 percent.

So anyhow, yes, it is possible to recover some lost energy due to things like heat radiation from a battery. But, chances are after you factor in the added cost of the 2nd engine, the added weight of the additional components, the added point of failure (you've got a bunch more stuff that can break down and frustrate you), in the end, it isn't worth it for anything more than perhaps geek bragging rights.

This is another situation where if the idea was practical, then automobile companies would add it to vehicles, beat their competition in terms of fuel efficiency, and get rich. Since this hasn't happened yet, it is fairly strong evidence that it isn't practical.

[Xyphix]

Originally Posted by verdatum

This is another situation where if the idea was practical, then automobile companies would add it to vehicles, beat their competition in terms of fuel efficiency, and get rich. Since this hasn't happened yet, it is fairly strong evidence that it isn't practical.

I'm sure it'll be practical in a few more years as the size of technology contiues to shrink, but I guess your right about it being compact and light enough to fit into a few square inches of space in an AT.

Well it was worth a suggestion since no one has suggested it at all in this forum. But I'm still sure we could find SOMETHING that'd work with the new technology. Curious question, though. Have wheels with built-in-motors been invented for practical use yet?

[verdatum]

Well, since we're talking thermodynamics, it works very differently from concepts like transistor miniaturization. The size and weight is needed to do the work. You'll notice the internal combustion engine in your car hasn't gotten much any smaller in the last hundred years or so. It is a similar principle.

Regarding wheels with built in motors, sure! they've been around for ages! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOlXsAzdn8Q
Unfortunately, the amount of force it can exert is limited by the weight inside it.

I don't know that there is a very strong market for wheels with integrated motors. It wouldn't be hard to build a simple one. You just weld/bolt the drive axle to the frame, and adhere the motor housing to the inside of a wheel. As previously discussed, the tough part is still finding a sufficiently high speed and high torque motor that is small enough to fit in the wheel.

Another problem, again, I think also touched upon in the past, is that building any sort of gearing mechanism in such a small space is difficult. I don't know that it would be impossible, but not easy.

[Xyphix]

You seem quite familiar with this technology. Ever thought of trying the project yourself?

[liamkap15]

hi im nothing like an engineer or anything like that and i suck at doing stuff with my hands i am 14 years old but i am very interested in AT's i can see all calculation and sketches but can some1 make an actual video or a something thats what i would really appreciate :P

[XxSPITFIRExX]

i think i might have found a motor you can use. look! http://www.amazon.com/Mini-4WD-Parts.../dp/B000BX0NBC

[verdatum]

This is a standard toy electric RC car motor. It is made to move something that weighs a couple pounds, not a couple hundred.

[ChibiBel]

If you have nearly $300 laying around, here's a good lookalike I found http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/pr...18020.12474345

[nyditch]

I've been kicking around the idea of building powered skates for a while, ever since I saw Air Gear. The battery is still an issue, though an 8-pound 12v 7Ah SLA battery should be able to move you around for a good hour or so. It would need to be in a backpack of some sort. No way you're fitting that into any kind of shoe.

THe motor, though, is quite do-able. Not to the extent it in in the show (fortunately), but a modified brushless outrunner motor can be turned into a hub motor, just like is used in the show. One like this would work nicely: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s..._600kv_.ht ml

Now the winding may still be a bit hot for this purpose, as more torque and less RPM would be preferred, but the sheer amount of power should be able to move a 150 pound person. It's rated at 800 watts of power each. A razor electric scooter is usually around 150 watts. 800*2/150 = 10 times the power.

The hub motor conversion takes a bit of work. I've done it before, but I need to come up with a new design that doesn't just rely on JB-Weld. The nice thing is, you can put a nice large shaft and big bearings on it though. I use this design with a smaller motor on my fighting robot, seen Here, but I could see it being used for many other things.

[aikawa4869]

is it really possible to make REAL air treck? if possible i really want to make it

[nyditch]

Update, with new battery breakthroughs as of recent, mainly in Lithium battery technology, I'll revise my last post and say that in the near future it may be possible to make AT's with a battery in the shoe.