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Unread 05-20-2013, 12:00 PM   #556
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Does verbal consent on taking pictures of a cosplayer count as a form of model consent?
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Unread 05-20-2013, 12:05 PM   #557
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In short, No, but it probably doesn't matter.

Legally speaking, in most instances you don't need a person's permission to take their picture, to display the picture in an editorial manner, or to sell the picture as a work of art (e.g. prints or a coffee table book). If you're going to use the images in a commercial manner (i.e. to advertise a product or service), you need a written and signed model release.

[edit] In most of the U.S. anyway. Different countries have different laws, I think France is way different.

Having said all that: Be nice, and ask permission - not because you're legally required, but because it's the nice thing to do.
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Unread 05-28-2013, 07:59 AM   #558
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Yes France is much more restrictive, for any public display of a photo you need the written consent of any person who's singled out on it (i.e. you don't need the consent of someone who's not recognisable, or who's part of a crowd) - no exception for art. If you want to earn money with the photo (i.e. publish it in a book, or sell prints), there needs to be a contract.

The only exception to this rule is information, and even then, if the photo was not taken at a public event, you can sue in the name of private life protection. Tabloids have it hard in France, they are very often sued, and lose all the time, having to publish the judge's decision in their pages, with the same importance as the photo they were sued for : if it was front page, they have to publish it on the front page. The money they have to pay is not dissuasive, though, they just take this kind of things into account in their budgets ^^;
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Unread 05-31-2013, 11:29 PM   #559
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I'm glad I don't live in Europe. This page says in Greece is is illegal to even take a photo of someone.
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Unread 08-04-2013, 02:41 PM   #560
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Do I need a flash?

Going to this years Otakon and I got a new DSLR that doesn't have a flash and a zoom lens that's a constant f2.8. In general, is f/2.8 usually good enough for indoor shooting without using a flash in a convention setting? Thanks.
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Unread 08-04-2013, 03:57 PM   #561
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lupohki View Post
Going to this years Otakon and I got a new DSLR that doesn't have a flash and a zoom lens that's a constant f2.8. In general, is f/2.8 usually good enough for indoor shooting without using a flash in a convention setting? Thanks.
Uhm it depends...at SDCC I was able to shoot indoors but near the large outside windows that let in lots of light without flash...but once I got into the exhibit halls it was a little too dark to shoot without flash. Unless I cranked up the ISO but that introduces noise and I hate noise
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Unread 08-04-2013, 05:00 PM   #562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lupohki View Post
Going to this years Otakon and I got a new DSLR that doesn't have a flash and a zoom lens that's a constant f2.8. In general, is f/2.8 usually good enough for indoor shooting without using a flash in a convention setting? Thanks.
As far as otakon goes, you should be able to get away with f/2.8 fairly easily during the day if you're near a window, but it'll get a little tricky in shaded areas or at night. My suggestion would be to spot meter for the shadows so that you can bring up the details in photoshop later.

Which camera did you get, by the way? The only major dSLRs I can think of without a pop-up flash are pretty high end ones.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 02:20 AM   #563
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This might be a weird question, and if there are any photographers who are uncomfortable with answering this question on the public forum, please feel free to PM me your answers.

I found a photographer who has AMAZING photos, so I started talking to him about doing a photoshoot. When we finally got around to talking about prices, he quoted me $150 for a single photoshoot.

That blew my mind, I was expecting to pay him, but not that much. I'm not really sure what I was expecting, since I've never paid for a shoot before I had nothing to base my guess off of. So my question is ... is this normal?

I've seen a lot of cosplayers with crazy amazing photos, and I always figured they paid for the shoot. But I guess a more specific question would be: what do you charge for a photoshoot that would produce pictures like these: http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs70/i/20...al-d39vt3u.jpg or http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/f/20...er-d3ivo4b.jpg (those aren't the best to ones I've seen, but the best of the ones I could find spur of the moment) or even better? I'm talking like, going all out, meeting up outside of a convention, doing lighting, posing, laying on the ground if you need to just to get the right angle, and moderate-ish photo editing to just make it look outstanding.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 03:11 AM   #564
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By the way guys and gals, as an amateur photographer who actually teaches photography in a photography group that I run, if you have any technical questions, such as, what aperture should I use, which lens would give me shallow depth of field for a good portrait shot and other puzzling questions, then, feel free to ask me whatever you have a problem with.
I shall do my best to help.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 08:33 AM   #565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor Moon View Post
I found a photographer who has AMAZING photos, so I started talking to him about doing a photoshoot. When we finally got around to talking about prices, he quoted me $150 for a single photoshoot.

That blew my mind, I was expecting to pay him, but not that much. I'm not really sure what I was expecting, since I've never paid for a shoot before I had nothing to base my guess off of. So my question is ... is this normal?
As a working professional photographer/videographer, I addressed this a little earlier in the thread. Here's what I wrote in post #552:

Quote:
It can vary quite widely. $200/hr can be reasonable. Free can also be reasonable.

How much is the photographer putting into it? Are they doing all the location scouting, pre-production planning, character research, etc? Are they experienced at giving posing direction, so that you feel comfortable and look your best? Are they helping with props and set pieces? Are they renting studio space, or using studio space that they own, or traveling really far out of their way to get to the shoot location? Is the photographer bringing lighting equipment, backup gear, an assistant?

Or.. at the other end of the scale: Are they just showing up to meet you at the local park, bringing nothing but an entry-level camera with kit lens and pop-up flash?

If it's a person who makes their full-time living at photography and who isn't into the cosplay and convention "scene" then you're going to be looking at some steep rates. If it's a professional who loves cosplay, or who thinks that the shoot will build their portfolio and/or skills, then you might get a reduced or free rate (see TykeJack's post, above). If it's a novice photographer who will be producing novice-quality pictures, then I wouldn't expect anything more expensive than free/TFCD.

For $200/hr, I would expect most or all of the following:
- A diverse portfolio showing high-quality shots in a style that matches your character;
- A well-equipped studio OR an exciting, thoroughly-scouted location;
- Confident production and direction of the shoot, including assistance with posing that's appropriate for your character and body type
- Lighting gear, and the knowledge to use it appropriately for the style and location;
- Backup equipment and perhaps an assistant.
- Skillful post-processing, and timely delivery of the finished product.
Personal notes:
- When we're working for a corporate client, our rates start at $100 per hour of shooting and can go up from there, depending on what else I need to make the results, how the final photo will be used, etc. I don't do additional charge for basic photo editing, but we charge the same hourly rate for video editing or extended photo editing. Plus we do a little markup on our expenses such as voiceover talent, buying stock footage, etc.
- When I'm working on a "fun" project, my rates start at $0 and can go up slightly, depending on expenses. Note that a "fun" project is one that *I* enjoy, and/or which will help my portfolio or expand my skill set.
- When I'm shooting at a con, my usual rate is $20 for a half hour, just to weed out the people that aren't serious about making good photos.
- If I approach or pursue a particular cosplayer or model for a shoot, I don't charge anything. In some cases I even pay for models. In those cases, it's not shooting for fun, it's shooting for work.

Don't underestimate the amount of effort that goes into making a top-quality photo. There's a lot more to it than just pointing the camera, mashing the shutter button, then running a couple of Photoshop actions you found on the internet.

Honestly, the shots you linked above are maybe a little above my current skill level, but hard to directly compare since they're outside of my usual style. I can say with certainty that those shots represent years of training and practice, not simply in operating the camera but also in vision, composition, posing direction, and skillful post-processing.
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Last edited by nathancarter : 08-07-2013 at 08:38 AM.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 11:19 AM   #566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathancarter View Post
Personal notes:
- When we're working for a corporate client, our rates start at $100 per hour of shooting and can go up from there, depending on what else I need to make the results, how the final photo will be used, etc. I don't do additional charge for basic photo editing, but we charge the same hourly rate for video editing or extended photo editing. Plus we do a little markup on our expenses such as voiceover talent, buying stock footage, etc.
- When I'm working on a "fun" project, my rates start at $0 and can go up slightly, depending on expenses. Note that a "fun" project is one that *I* enjoy, and/or which will help my portfolio or expand my skill set.
- When I'm shooting at a con, my usual rate is $20 for a half hour, just to weed out the people that aren't serious about making good photos.
- If I approach or pursue a particular cosplayer or model for a shoot, I don't charge anything. In some cases I even pay for models. In those cases, it's not shooting for fun, it's shooting for work.

Don't underestimate the amount of effort that goes into making a top-quality photo. There's a lot more to it than just pointing the camera, mashing the shutter button, then running a couple of Photoshop actions you found on the internet.

Honestly, the shots you linked above are maybe a little above my current skill level, but hard to directly compare since they're outside of my usual style. I can say with certainty that those shots represent years of training and practice, not simply in operating the camera but also in vision, composition, posing direction, and skillful post-processing.
Thank you so much for your reply!

I'm sorry, I should have checked back a couple of pages to see if a similar question like this had been asked, but thanks again for posting your reply =)

I definitely understand where you're coming from with the prices. The photographer I'm talking to is a professional, he does photography for a living, HOWEVER, he does not have a lot of experience shooting cosplays (he does things like weddings, concerts, senior photos, etc) but he's into anime and comic books and stuff like that, so he when he shot my mom's wedding and I started talking to him about his photography, and mentioned that I did cosplay, he LOVED that, and since I've been talking to him he said he's excited about it and might even consider getting into doing cosplay photography if he likes working with me and likes how the photos come out and such.

As for this list:
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathancarter
For $200/hr, I would expect most or all of the following:
- A diverse portfolio showing high-quality shots in a style that matches your character;
- A well-equipped studio OR an exciting, thoroughly-scouted location;
- Confident production and direction of the shoot, including assistance with posing that's appropriate for your character and body type
- Lighting gear, and the knowledge to use it appropriately for the style and location;
- Backup equipment and perhaps an assistant.
- Skillful post-processing, and timely delivery of the finished product.
The things I bolded I know he can do/does already. The underlined things are things he does not do. Regular text I'm not sure about.

He has some great photos, but none of them are styled like I would need, however through talking to him I believe he can do it, he has a good idea of what's appropriate, as I've talked to him extensively about it.
He doesn't have a studio, but he did send me some locations near him that we could do the shooting, I'll be going up there to meet him (he's in Dallas, I'm in Houston) while I'm at a convention.
He has no idea about posing, that'll be up to me, but that's ok because sometimes I prefer it that way.
I'm not sure what qualifies as 'back up equipment' but he does not have an assistant, I'll actually be providing the 'assistant' XD My boyfriend comes with me to all of my photoshoots and always ends up helping out by holding up my cape, or holding a piece of lighting, fixing my hair if it's messed up and I'm holding a pose, etc.

Considering he does this for a living and not just a hobby, I am totally ok with paying him, but because he doesn't have the experience with cosplay shots and is doing this because he wants to try it out and possibly get into it, I feel like the price shouldn't be really high. It's like he's a professional and a beginner at the same time XD Does that make sense? Is that a fair evaluation? lol.

Thanks again for your help, I'm still talking with him about prices I just wanted to get some help on what I should be paying for this shoot.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 01:00 PM   #567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor Moon View Post
He has some great photos, but none of them are styled like I would need, however through talking to him I believe he can do it, he has a good idea of what's appropriate, as I've talked to him extensively about it.
He doesn't have a studio, but he did send me some locations near him that we could do the shooting, I'll be going up there to meet him (he's in Dallas, I'm in Houston) while I'm at a convention.
He has no idea about posing, that'll be up to me, but that's ok because sometimes I prefer it that way.
I'm not sure what qualifies as 'back up equipment' but he does not have an assistant, I'll actually be providing the 'assistant' XD My boyfriend comes with me to all of my photoshoots and always ends up helping out by holding up my cape, or holding a piece of lighting, fixing my hair if it's messed up and I'm holding a pose, etc.
On backup equipment: You drive all the way to Dallas, spend an hour getting your makeup and hair perfect, you're posed and beautiful, and on the first shot his camera goes "ker-CHUNK-fizzzzz" instead of "click." Now what?
a) Shoot's off, sorry to have wasted your day, bye?
b) Let me call my buddy to see if I can borrow his camera, it might take a couple hours, meanwhile you stand and wait and sweat in the Dallas sun?
c) Give me two minutes to get the other camera body out of my trunk and we'll make this happen.

If he's a working pro he should have backup gear, but it's reasonable of you to ask. It might not be as good as his primary gear, but it should be more than adequate to get the work done. No wedding photographer worth his salt works without backup gear, because you definitely can't reschedule a wedding due to camera failure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor Moon View Post
Considering he does this for a living and not just a hobby, I am totally ok with paying him, but because he doesn't have the experience with cosplay shots and is doing this because he wants to try it out and possibly get into it, I feel like the price shouldn't be really high. It's like he's a professional and a beginner at the same time XD Does that make sense? Is that a fair evaluation? lol.
Yes, that's absolutely a fair evaluation.

He may very well be open to negotiation, and you're certainly within your rights to make a counter offer. On one hand, this is an opportunity for him to try new things, experiment with different lighting techniques, learn new posing tricks, and take all the risks that he simply can't take during a wedding. ...but on the other hand, photographers are incessantly inundated with requests for free shoots that will "look great in your portfolio," so it's a fine line you've got to walk. Long story short, if he's past doing TFCD (read: free) to build his skill set, you've got to really make it worth his while to consider another TFCD shoot.
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Unread 08-07-2013, 03:53 PM   #568
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathancarter View Post
On backup equipment: You drive all the way to Dallas, spend an hour getting your makeup and hair perfect, you're posed and beautiful, and on the first shot his camera goes "ker-CHUNK-fizzzzz" instead of "click." Now what?
a) Shoot's off, sorry to have wasted your day, bye?
b) Let me call my buddy to see if I can borrow his camera, it might take a couple hours, meanwhile you stand and wait and sweat in the Dallas sun?
c) Give me two minutes to get the other camera body out of my trunk and we'll make this happen.

If he's a working pro he should have backup gear, but it's reasonable of you to ask. It might not be as good as his primary gear, but it should be more than adequate to get the work done. No wedding photographer worth his salt works without backup gear, because you definitely can't reschedule a wedding due to camera failure.
Ah, ok, I wasn't 100% sure what you meant, but yeah I believe he has 3 cameras, I saw him with at least 2 different ones at my mom's wedding and the bag he was carrying could easily fit 3 plus all the extra lenses and gear. So yes he does have backup gear.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nathancarter View Post
Yes, that's absolutely a fair evaluation.

He may very well be open to negotiation, and you're certainly within your rights to make a counter offer. On one hand, this is an opportunity for him to try new things, experiment with different lighting techniques, learn new posing tricks, and take all the risks that he simply can't take during a wedding. ...but on the other hand, photographers are incessantly inundated with requests for free shoots that will "look great in your portfolio," so it's a fine line you've got to walk. Long story short, if he's past doing TFCD (read: free) to build his skill set, you've got to really make it worth his while to consider another TFCD shoot.
Ok cool, I'm glad I wasn't far off then. He is open to negotiating the price but I just have NO idea on what to offer him. I don't want to offer him something too low and offend him, but at the same time I don't want to over pay, or end up paying a lot and not get the photos I'm expecting. That's why I was hoping to get some quotes from photographers on here, so I could have something to compare it to.

Thanks again for all your help ^_^
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Unread 08-09-2013, 12:50 AM   #569
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Unread 08-09-2013, 07:17 AM   #570
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Brea ~ I PMed you my response to your post.
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