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Unread 08-19-2013, 10:09 AM   #571
genkimami
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How long is it acceptable/average/usual to wait to receive photos back after doing a paid photoshoot with a photographer? I've been doing most of my cosplay photoshoots with the same person who does amazing work, but for the past year it has been taking that person longer and longer to send us photos back.

I know if I'm not happy with the service I get with someone I should just take my business elsewhere, but since I've mostly shot with the same person I don't really know what's the average waiting time to receive photos after a photoshoot.

Thanks!
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Unread 08-19-2013, 10:48 AM   #572
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Tough call. Varies, depending on circumstances. However, the photographer should be able to give you an estimate at the time of the shoot, if you ask.

As a general rule, I try to turn things around within about a week, maybe two if I'm doing more elaborate processing. However, if I'm really slammed (e.g. right after a con where I did a dozen different shoots) it may take longer - but I'll try to make sure my client/subject/model knows that up front.

Bottom line: Politely ask the photographer.
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Unread 08-20-2013, 12:47 AM   #573
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Hi Sailor Moon,

It's common to get some sticker shock when you've never been involved in a photoshoot before. As a reference range, if I were to do a planned paid shoot under the conditions of those samples you posted, I would start around $150 and probably top off around $350 if the logistics are difficult. For me, personally, since I don't do this as a living and make more money in my regular job per hour involved in the shoot, you can see how the price range can depend heavily on my personal interest in the model's work and how much enjoyment I would get out of the shoot. One way to look at it is to consider how many hours would be involved in setting up the shoot, the shoot itself, the processing and (here's the wild card), the amount of time invested in the photographer's skillset before the shoot ever occurred. To determine that last part, I'd have to see samples of the photog's work to give you my personal estimate.

That said, while that gives you an idea of a fair price, your own personal price should just depend on what you think the experience and end product will be for you, regardless of anything the photographer brings to the table. If you really think $150 is too high for you, I personally wouldn't take offense if someone told me that they thought my work is certainly worth my asking price on the market, but for them personally they aren't invested enough in getting the photos for that cost.

To give you more solid numbers, I work with a single camera body valued in the 2-3K range and an accompaniment of lenses of around 1-2K. For lighting gear I've switched my entire set to a cheap portable 2-light strobist setup which comes out to around $300. For an actor's headshot shoot that would take up 3-5 hours of my day (including travel time) and another 1-3 hours of my time processing the images, with the expectation of around 5-10 quality images, I would start at $150ish and top off around $250 depending on the logistics I expect to be involved. At this price I would be losing money considering the time investment (~$25-40/hour). Which is why usually I do actor's headshots only for friends/friends or friends.

For cosplay shoots I bleed probably more money in camera gear than the cosplayer does in creating their costume as I charge pretty much zero outside of small nominal fees to help cover gas and parking costs. I do this because I'm really interested in cosplay stuff right now and just have fun doing it, even though it's far more difficult working with your average cosplayer to get a good image than working with your average actor who's trained to perform in front of the camera.

Hope that helps in some way. =)
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Unread 08-20-2013, 03:49 PM   #574
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WonJohnSoup View Post
Hi Sailor Moon,

It's common to get some sticker shock when you've never been involved in a photoshoot before. As a reference range, if I were to do a planned paid shoot under the conditions of those samples you posted, I would start around $150 and probably top off around $350 if the logistics are difficult. For me, personally, since I don't do this as a living and make more money in my regular job per hour involved in the shoot, you can see how the price range can depend heavily on my personal interest in the model's work and how much enjoyment I would get out of the shoot. One way to look at it is to consider how many hours would be involved in setting up the shoot, the shoot itself, the processing and (here's the wild card), the amount of time invested in the photographer's skillset before the shoot ever occurred. To determine that last part, I'd have to see samples of the photog's work to give you my personal estimate.

That said, while that gives you an idea of a fair price, your own personal price should just depend on what you think the experience and end product will be for you, regardless of anything the photographer brings to the table. If you really think $150 is too high for you, I personally wouldn't take offense if someone told me that they thought my work is certainly worth my asking price on the market, but for them personally they aren't invested enough in getting the photos for that cost.

To give you more solid numbers, I work with a single camera body valued in the 2-3K range and an accompaniment of lenses of around 1-2K. For lighting gear I've switched my entire set to a cheap portable 2-light strobist setup which comes out to around $300. For an actor's headshot shoot that would take up 3-5 hours of my day (including travel time) and another 1-3 hours of my time processing the images, with the expectation of around 5-10 quality images, I would start at $150ish and top off around $250 depending on the logistics I expect to be involved. At this price I would be losing money considering the time investment (~$25-40/hour). Which is why usually I do actor's headshots only for friends/friends or friends.

For cosplay shoots I bleed probably more money in camera gear than the cosplayer does in creating their costume as I charge pretty much zero outside of small nominal fees to help cover gas and parking costs. I do this because I'm really interested in cosplay stuff right now and just have fun doing it, even though it's far more difficult working with your average cosplayer to get a good image than working with your average actor who's trained to perform in front of the camera.

Hope that helps in some way. =)
Yes, thank you this does help quite a bit =) But I've done dozens of photoshoots before, just never any paid ones, that's why I was asking. I totally understand where you're coming from, and it does make sense. I think I've managed to figure out a price with the photographer that we both think is fair, so here's to hoping everything goes well! Thanks again for the info!
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Unread 08-26-2013, 02:33 AM   #575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathancarter View Post
In short, No, but it probably doesn't matter.

Legally speaking, in most instances you don't need a person's permission to take their picture, to display the picture in an editorial manner, or to sell the picture as a work of art (e.g. prints or a coffee table book). If you're going to use the images in a commercial manner (i.e. to advertise a product or service), you need a written and signed model release.

[edit] In most of the U.S. anyway. Different countries have different laws, I think France is way different.

Having said all that: Be nice, and ask permission - not because you're legally required, but because it's the nice thing to do.
Given what has happened recently with heroes of cosplay, does that mean if no signed model release was obtained, the cosplayer who modeled for the shot still can decide on whether or not to agree on the release of the shot?
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Unread 08-26-2013, 02:58 AM   #576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkCloudInc View Post
Given what has happened recently with heroes of cosplay, does that mean if no signed model release was obtained, the cosplayer who modeled for the shot still can decide on whether or not to agree on the release of the shot?
Not entirely sure what you're asking, but yes, a cosplayer can decide after the fact to sign a release. They don't, however, get to decide to release the image themselves or have any say in how it's released unless that's directly arranged in the contract. So just because a model doesn't sign a release, doesn't mean they have power to do what they want with the image. The image still belongs to the photographer whether they signed it or not.
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Unread 08-26-2013, 11:10 AM   #577
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkCloudInc View Post
Given what has happened recently with heroes of cosplay, does that mean if no signed model release was obtained, the cosplayer who modeled for the shot still can decide on whether or not to agree on the release of the shot?
Short answer: Yes. Sort-of. Both the cosplayer and the photographer have to agree.

If the image is being used in a commercial manner - that is, endorsing or promoting a product or service (or in this case, TV show) - then the client (NBCUniversal, SyFy, Heroes of Cosplay) needs a usage license from the photographer AND, separately, a model release from the cosplayer. Unless otherwise explicitly agreed upon, the photographer can not give a release on behalf of the model, and the model cam not grant a usage license on behalf of the photographer. They're entirely separate agreements - one agreement between the client and the photographer, and an agreement between the client and the model.

In many cases, a paid model will give the commercial photographer a transferable release, so that the photographer can give permission to the client on behalf of the model. This happens quite often. If you signed a model release when a photographer took your photo, it may have included a right to transfer that release. READ YOUR MODEL RELEASES; if they're too complex, ask for clarifications in real-people language or don't pose for the shoot.

In a few rare cases, the photographer will give the model a transferable usage license, so that the model can grant certain types of usage to a third party. This generally only happens with the model's portfolio images, since the model will want her agency to be able to use those images.

COPYRIGHT OWNERSHIP remains the property of the photographer, period. The photographer can - and very often does - grant the model a license to copy and use and display and sell the image. THIS IS NOT COPYRIGHT; It's just a usage license. The model or cosplayer does not own copyrights to the images, unless the photographer signs a transfer of copyright, in which cases the images are no longer the property of the photographer, and instead become the property of the model (this just about never actually happens). There's no joint copyright ownership either, unless you jump through a bunch of legal hoops.

On commercial use:
Art and journalism are not considered commercial use, even if there's money involved. The photographer DOES NOT NEED a model release from the cosplayer to display the images, sell prints, sell books containing the images, or sell body pillows displaying the images. In my personal opinion, it's pretty scummy to do some of these things without the cosplayer's knowledge or permission, but it's quite legal. There are some lousy people in the world, and some of them own cameras.


BIG OL' DISCLAIMER: I'm not a lawyer, please don't take any of this as legal advice. However, I am a working professional photographer and videographer, and I mostly know my way around copyright laws as they pertain to photography. In the past I haven't bothered much with model releases for informal, fun shoots like cosplay photography, but after this Heroes of Cosplay nonsense and the drama around "body-pillow-gate," I'm going to be more meticulous about getting signed releases. Makes me a little sad, actually.

[Edit] This information is valid for the United States, to the best of my knowledge. Definitely varies by country, may vary by state.
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Unread 09-06-2013, 06:43 PM   #578
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Hi forum I never venture to:

I have some basic questions for you seasoned photographers and for those that get booked for photo shoots. My group is looking to book some for a convention in January (SacAnime) and have yet to book anyone before. So, before we go into it without any prior knowledge, a few questions:

Q: With a group of 2-3 people, and a variety of poses, singles and group shots, about how long to you allocate for such a shoot? For those of you who do shoots for the fun of it and do not charge, what do you typically offer for free? For those of you who charge, who do you offer and about how much do you typically charge in whole, or per hour? Do you expect money up front, or do you expect it at the time the photos are completed?

Q: Aside from my group being there, on time and eager to get things done, what do you expect from us aside from what we want, poses, location...ect?

Q: What should I expect from the photographer aside form being on time with his/her camera gear in hand and ready to go?

Q: Turn around time. About how long do you turn on photos once the convention is over and done with?

Q: Did I miss anything (I probably missed something)? Feel free to fill in the blanks. Thanks for the suggestions to those that reply. *Tips internet hat*
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Unread 09-08-2013, 02:47 AM   #579
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Unread 09-08-2013, 03:21 PM   #580
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eau de Decus View Post
Hi forum I never venture to:

I have some basic questions for you seasoned photographers and for those that get booked for photo shoots. My group is looking to book some for a convention in January (SacAnime) and have yet to book anyone before. So, before we go into it without any prior knowledge, a few questions:

Q: With a group of 2-3 people, and a variety of poses, singles and group shots, about how long to you allocate for such a shoot? For those of you who do shoots for the fun of it and do not charge, what do you typically offer for free? For those of you who charge, who do you offer and about how much do you typically charge in whole, or per hour? Do you expect money up front, or do you expect it at the time the photos are completed?

Q: Aside from my group being there, on time and eager to get things done, what do you expect from us aside from what we want, poses, location...ect?

Q: What should I expect from the photographer aside form being on time with his/her camera gear in hand and ready to go?

Q: Turn around time. About how long do you turn on photos once the convention is over and done with?

Q: Did I miss anything (I probably missed something)? Feel free to fill in the blanks. Thanks for the suggestions to those that reply. *Tips internet hat*
Hi,
I've answered most of these over the past couple of pages - at least, according to the way I do things. Look in posts #552 and #565 for some more detail.

Quick answers:
1) My slots for small groups or individuals in a convention setting are 30 minutes, with at least a 15-minute buffer between back-to-back sessions.

2) Hmm, that can be answered in a number of ways. I'd expect competence - the photographer is ready to shoot at (or near) your designated start time, doesn't fumble around too much with settings, and manages to get a good variety of shots in the allotted time slot. A more experienced photographer will be better at most of these things. An experienced portrait photographer should also offer posing guidance.
For more detail, see what I put in post #552.

3) Again, varies. If I'm shooting nonstop for a four-day convention, it's going to take a couple of weeks to get through them all - BUT, I make sure to explain that to everyone I'm shooting. Also, if I'm shooting a particular set that's going to require a lot of post-processing (e.g. background replacement, etc) then a couple of weeks is reasonable. For quick portraits if I'm not super busy, I can get them turned around within a day or two.

After a con, I usually need a day or two of recovery - lugging around 40-50lbs of photo gear for the whole con is just as exhausting as wearing a heavy and hot costume

4) Not all photographers are the same. Different skill levels, different lighting styles, different turnaround times, different post-processing styles.
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Unread 09-14-2013, 04:25 PM   #581
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I had a photoshoot with a photographer around 3 weeks ago. It was on location and paid, not a large fee, but paid no less, and have yet to see any photos. I would be happy with even just a teaser shot (which she said would be up the day after the shoot).
So my question is how long should a cosplayer wait until it's acceptable to ask for photos or ask on the progress of the photos?
I don't want to be naggy, but I'm very excited.
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Unread 09-14-2013, 07:33 PM   #582
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Originally Posted by ichigo_m. View Post
I had a photoshoot with a photographer around 3 weeks ago. It was on location and paid, not a large fee, but paid no less, and have yet to see any photos. I would be happy with even just a teaser shot (which she said would be up the day after the shoot).
So my question is how long should a cosplayer wait until it's acceptable to ask for photos or ask on the progress of the photos?
I don't want to be naggy, but I'm very excited.
They should have given you an estimate on when they'd be done, so as soon as the estimated date passes it is acceptable to inquire. If they haven't made contact with you yet or kept you in the loop, then I think 3 weeks is perfectly fine to make an inquiry.
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Unread 09-29-2013, 02:46 AM   #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ichigo_m. View Post
I had a photoshoot with a photographer around 3 weeks ago. It was on location and paid, not a large fee, but paid no less, and have yet to see any photos. I would be happy with even just a teaser shot (which she said would be up the day after the shoot).
So my question is how long should a cosplayer wait until it's acceptable to ask for photos or ask on the progress of the photos?
I don't want to be naggy, but I'm very excited.
3 weeks is definitely okay to ask on the progress of photos, especially if they are paid, and especially if she didn't give you a timeframe to expect the photos.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeyy View Post
I will be cosplaying for the first time this year. (For Halloween, and conventions next year.)
The character I'm cosplaying is very skinny and small, unlike myself. She is Yoshino from Date A Live. I haven't wore my cosplay out to public or any cons yet, but the photoshoot is a thought. I feel okay about my cosplay. I don't think I'd look very good though. And I consider myself VERY non-photogenic.

Even if I'm serious about getting a photoshoot, there's tons of problems (aside from finding an actual photographer or location):
- I'm only 14.....
- I'm hella self-conscious. Having a stranger take pictures of me wouldn't be the greatest idea...
- What if the pictures don't turn out the way I wanted them to be? /: It'd be rude not to post the picturescuz the photographer took time out of their lives to take them for me.
- Prices aaahhh
If you are unconfident about your cosplay and your posing, you might just want a friend to take some pictures for you with a point-and-shoot first. That way, you can practice posing in front of the camera.

Or you can pay an experienced photographer that can give you direction on posing. (Ask local cosplayers on which photographers in your area are good with this)

A lot of cosplayers do not repost photos that photographers took of them anyway, so don't worry about it.
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Unread 11-08-2013, 12:26 PM   #584
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As someone who's specializes in dynamic props, such as wings and transforming weapons (gambol shroud), I'm wondering:
How do you shoot something that transforms or is very dynamic?
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Unread 11-13-2013, 12:37 PM   #585
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As a cosplayer, I recently had a photographer go on my personal cosplay site and flag every single photo he took as a copyright violation. Can they do that?
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