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Unread 02-12-2011, 12:28 AM   #16
doxiequeen1
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I really, really hate photoshopped pictures of people. I love photoshop in general, but really I hate people that use it to improve their appearance.

I strongly believe in makeup over photoshop. It can alter your appearance just as much and then you look more in character at the convention and in any photos you find of yourself online. Their is no reason to use a computer program to fix something a little concealer could.

People that photoshop their bodies...Really? I could be thinner, sure. But faking it is stupid, I like looking in photos exactly how I look in real life. Maybe that's just me.

/endrant

I don't mind photoshop used to improve a photo, contrast, exposure ect. But changing someones appearance in a picture just seems wrong to me.

Last edited by doxiequeen1 : 02-12-2011 at 12:31 AM.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 12:31 AM   #17
Aleiki
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I love Photoshop, and I love playing with it. For the most part, when I use it to change photos, I'm fixing blemishes or playing with the color just a tad--for the most part, it's just to see how well I can do it.

There have been times when I've done a complete overhaul of a picture of myself: again, just to see if I can. I've put a couple of them online... I don't think I've put any on cosplay.com, though, since by the time I'm done with them, it's not about the cosplay, it's about the manipulation. Perhaps I want to showcase that as art, since I do believe photomanipulation can be a skill and art. But I make it clear that it's very manipulated, and I will readily tell them everything I've changed and provide an original if anyone asks.

So, yeah, I think using photoshop to deceive people is wrong. And I wouldn't do much beyond fixing blemishes and pretend that it's my actual cosplay. I work hard on my cosplay so that what I walk around in is the final product--not what I post online after I've mutilated it. But at the same time, I think some of the girls on that website may have (and I have no clue, so emphasis on "may") just done those photo manipulations to see if they could. A few of them are done quite well. (Some are awful, and manipulated to the point where it's not physically possible, but that's not the point.)

All that to say: I think photoshopping has its place, and I think it can be done for fun or improving skill. But your cosplay isn't made in Photoshop, it's made in real life--it's not fair to lie to people.

Last edited by Aleiki : 02-12-2011 at 12:33 AM.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 12:38 AM   #18
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The most I ever do is remove bags under my eyes and any skin breakouts.

Although I've seen half those images before, the ones that make their faces more doll/flawless/anime-like will always creep me the hell out. So unnatural!
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Unread 02-12-2011, 02:19 AM   #19
Hetalia-Chan
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Wasn't this topic on 4chan before?
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Unread 02-12-2011, 02:27 AM   #20
kiratsukai
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Again I have to ask: why would anyone even care?

Assuming the goal is to have something nice to look at at the end of the day and each party has consented to the change: photoshop yourself some gills and a set of extra breasts if you want.

People are all too concerned with passing judgement on the people in the media rather than just the media itself.

Chances are, you don't know who is using photoshop or when... and if you're looking for it that closely in others photos, you may have very real envy issues to work out.

As for me: I use photoshop in more than half of my photos to remove blemishes, smooth out makeup coverage, remove dark circles and adjust lighting. I do it on photos of myself, of my friends, of people I don't even know.

Why? Because it just looks nicer and a lot of people, including me, are just more confident about themselves looking at something that's polished up a bit. No one wants to look at the pimple that decided to burst out of their forehead on the eve of the event after the fact. The ability to erase it makes that event less stressful and if someone sends me photos without the pimple so as not to remind me it was there at all, I'm intensely greatful ^^

Weird cultural difference time: There is actually a debate in the Japanese cosplay community going on in the last few years about photoshop... but it isn't this one. Rather, it's if it's rude of photographers and other cosplayers to upload unphotoshopped images of you or your group and what proper etiquette is in photoshopping others. If your friend photoshops out all of your features, are you offended or happy? If a photographer takes gorgeous photos of you and obtains your permission to post them online but doesn't cover up your pores, is he being a turd? Or would his covering up your crow's feet offend you?

Photoshopping others is a delicate topic... but photoshopping yourself -- go NUTS! Photoshop is a tool. Just like makeup, lighting and reflectors are tools.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 02:28 AM   #21
fabrickind
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Most of those photos looks really fake and bad to me. :/ Especially the ones where they make the girls skinnier, since they seemed to have shopped some parts but left other parts the same or mostly the same (really skinny waist, really huge boobs, but also too wide of a ribcage or too thick of a breastplate for the frame size they gave them elsewhere, that kind of thing), and the proportions seem really off.


I prefer to have shopped photos. I think that photos that have been shopped at least a little look much better than those that have not been touched, even if it is just to fix contrast and to smooth some blemishes. It can go too far, though. The heaviest shopping I have ever done was on the Regina photo in my gallery, and besides doing some minor colour fixing, background blurring, etc., I fixed my briefs so they weren't sagging down, like how the costume is meant to be. (And I will gladly post the original for anyone to see! I'm pretty open about fixing it, haha.) I'm fine with heavier editing for things like that -- fixing parts that were somehow out of place (sagging briefs, accidentally scuffed shoes, slipping tops, showing bra straps, etc.), and with minor tweaks (levels, contrast, colours, cropping, fixing blemishes [without making the skin look like plastic, of course!], slight makeup enhancement [not totally changing, adding, or subtracting makeup, but fixing things like fading lipstick, makeup that didn't quite show up on camera, that kind of thing], etc.)

I think of Photoshop like wearing (daily, not special costume effect) makeup -- it is meant to enhance what is already there, not for looking like a different person.

I really don't care if someone wants to shop their photos (correctly) to make themselves look drastically better, but it is very misleading and both perpetuates and is falling victim to too-high beauty standards. I can understand doing the editing just for fun, though, as long as it isn't used to deceive. Good Photoshop is not a replacement for good cosplay, but it can be used to make a good cosplay (/cosplayer/cosplay photo) look better.

Last edited by fabrickind : 02-12-2011 at 02:30 AM.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 07:14 AM   #22
Nayara
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hetalia-Chan View Post
Wasn't this topic on 4chan before?
It's been done a thousand times there. Just look at /cgl/.

Anway, I just wanted to mention that some of the girls and guys shown on that website didn't necessarily give their permission to get their photos shopped. A lot of people simply take pictures from the internet and play around with them, without the models knowing about it.

Best example is that one guy on deviantArt, who simply "likes to make people more beautiful". He made that famous shop of Nel Tu:



The girl didn't give permission. He did lotsa other stuff, people complained and called him an art thief and thus: he learned to ask. =__= -> "I just want to beautify people"
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Unread 02-12-2011, 07:16 AM   #23
BabemRoze
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I don't think it's right to photoshop yourself to the extent where you look completely different >< the only times I photoshop is if I want to get rid of a spot or blemish or the strand of hair that sticks out of place. I'm not a huge perfectionist but I notice lil annoying things like that and like to get rid of them when I can :P
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Unread 02-12-2011, 10:06 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nayara View Post
Best example is that one guy on deviantArt, who simply "likes to make people more beautiful". He made that famous shop of Nel Tu:
The girl didn't give permission. He did lotsa other stuff, people complained and called him an art thief and thus: he learned to ask. =__= -> "I just want to beautify people"
I hope he understood why they were upset. Sure, the finished photo is lovely, but so is the original. And to completely change someone's face, saying "I just want to beautify people" is like saying, "Gee, I thought you were ugly." Not nice, especially with someone as pretty as the girl who did that Nel. I could see increasing the contrast and color, taking off the bandaid, and making her make-up show up better, but completely changing the face? I would be offended if it were me.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 10:29 AM   #25
Kildread
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiratsukai View Post
Why? Because it just looks nicer and a lot of people, including me, are just more confident about themselves looking at something that's polished up a bit. No one wants to look at the pimple that decided to burst out of their forehead on the eve of the event after the fact. The ability to erase it makes that event less stressful and if someone sends me photos without the pimple so as not to remind me it was there at all, I'm intensely greatful ^^
Out of curiosity (And not for the sake of arguementing) --- is it the event or the after-the-fact photos that are important?

I mean, the aforementionned pimple is going to stand out on your forehead the entire event, staring down anyone who takes your picture or sees you there. Editing it out after the fact can make for better photos (And better nostalgy pictures), but the glaring pimple was only erased in the image.

I don't know if the japanese cosplay community is more self-conscious of personal flaws though --- so this might be a view that's different according to culture.

I absolutely love taking pictures and displaying them over facebook for the attendees, some turn out well, others not so much --- but I like to assume the attendees had boatloads of fun at the event and the pictures are there to remind themselves of such.

For photoshoots? Photoshop is normally part of the deal. For hallway photography? It seems a little overkill.

I'll readily agree with you that you can do whatever you want with your own photos and be wary about editing other people's photos. In the end, I prefer natural photography over simulating perfection, as amazing as the end product seems --- it still registers as a little fake in the end.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 12:52 PM   #26
UchihaSasuK8
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I never photoshop; not cos I am precious about it or have some moral objection, just cos I don't really have time to learn to use it that well to be sure I could do somthing and it look better not worse. At most, I use the MS Picture Manager to auto-levels it if it was getting a little dark etc, or crop-out someone who walked across the back of the shot to get a better compositon to the shot.

Maybe I am wrong but I feel that generally my make-up etc covers the worst of my skin issues and as I am not using a SLR type camera anyway I am pretty happy with what I get as they are.

I totally agree that photoshop is just another tool for a cosplayer to improve the overall shot and where you can put in an effect to really bring a great costume to life - if you want to remove that stray hair or dark circle cos then you are happier then awesome.
However I guess if you take the argument to an extreme you could say that if you change absolutely everything in the shot with photoshop then is it even cosplay anymore? I mean why not just start with a random-googled shot model wearing totally the wrong clothes and hair and just alter it all so they they look identical to the character?
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Unread 02-12-2011, 01:06 PM   #27
Amanita
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About that Nel photo from deviantart- I can see some places where the guy did a good thing touching up the image, such as removing the bandaid and improving that makeup under her eyes. But why the heck did he practically renovate her face? She was fine the way she was!

As for photoshop, I sometimes photoshop in lightsaber blades, and I'll definately edit out pimples and blemishes, but that's it. I'm not going to make myself look skinny, as much as I wish I was.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 01:07 PM   #28
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I honestly think that photoshop should only be used to enhance the PHOTO, not the person (cropping/lighting). Most people are terrible at photoshopping the body anyway. It almost always looks fake and the proportion never looks right. I also think that changing someones proportion and skin tone is not the same as applying makeup. This is just my opinion though. A majority of the photos on that site looked better in their original form and the 'shopped ones look extremely fake and just bizarre. They could just use a bit of photoshopping to enhance the overall photo (lighting/cropping).
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Unread 02-12-2011, 03:33 PM   #29
SweetOcarina
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I don't find anything wrong with 'shopping yourself skinny or whatever. I figure that by the time it gets to cosplay photography, you are creating art. If you cannot match your interpretation of the character naturally, why not enhance yourself with photoshop? Why not make your breasts bigger, your waist smaller, remove those pesky glasses you forgot to take off or reduce your buckteeth? Photoshopping on make-up too, isn't really an issue. You are taking a photo to look like the character afterall, not show off particularly who you are yourself.
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Unread 02-12-2011, 04:01 PM   #30
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I work in graphic design and I worked specifically on models for well over a year and spent many tireless hours making them presentable...with all that said I generally don't post a single picture of myself that isn't touched up on some way or another. But only minor issues like lighting, color corrections, or a skin defect here or there.

I've never seen an issue with doing basic photo editing before posting - but I DO see an issue with making drastic changes to the model. Things like hacking off loads of weight or getting too blur-happy with the skin. I understand that people have body image issues or they can't have a professional photographer - but really once you're in photoshop it is too late.

When doing a photo shoot is important (especially if you're an amateur photographer or you're having a friend snap photos) to remember that more is best. I've recieved files of 100's of photos of professional models and only 10% or less have been GREAT shots. This is completely normal, people shift second-to-second and if you're working outdoors so does natural lighting.
Wear the right undergarments! If your bra is too tight, it is going to emphasize any fat you have especially around your back! If you really dislike your hips or stomach look into some compression underwear to use during your cosplay or photoshoot. Don't try to take it out in PS - most of the time it'll look unnatural.
Wear lots-o good makeup if you have an uneven skintone. Skin is one of the simpler things to fix in PS but it is also the easiest thing to overdo. If you surface blur the hell out of it the skin will look completely unnatural. Invest in good makeup - it doesn't have to be makeup you wear every day - just your super awesome special stash that you pull out for cameras and special events (like cons!)
Practice posing and read up on how to pose best to compliment your form! If you hate your stomach try not to turn it to the side of the camera. If you think you have a double chin don't pull your chin down toward's your neck. Stand in a mirror and make faces for fun or do a test shoot with a friend (or a tripod) before your event.
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