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Unread 01-28-2004, 10:21 PM   #1
DeadLegato
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What do YOU call EGL?

Gah, I hate to start two posts in a day, but I checked some old posts of mine and found someone had replied to one I made after I stopped checking it, commenting that a dress I found to be very EGL was... very not EGL, in their opinion. (I still stand by my decision that, being pink, incredibly fluffy and lacy with a victorian style to it that it WAS EGL, but each person can hold their own opinion).

Now, I'm not sure that this belongs in this section, but it's not really general and it's not really a rant... I was just wanting to get some opinons on what does/does not constitute EGL. I mean, I've read the Gothic Lolita Bibles (all the ones I can borrow from Japanese friends, that is) and quite often they have stuff in them such as red and black flannel bondage pants and red and black stripped hoodies. Yo know, the kind of stuff you could buy right off the rack at hottopic. So I don't think the EGL style can be limited to "Black and fluffy only." So I'm wondering... what EXACTLY is it? Does it have to come specifically out of the "EGL" section of a japanese webpage, or can it be frilly and lace things found at consignment shops? (The general impression I got from my other post was that if it wasn't specifically made to be EGL, then it didnt count.)

So yeah, let's get some opinions rolling!
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Unread 01-28-2004, 10:41 PM   #2
Dolly_Entrails
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Things that are dark, frilly, classically gothic, and victorian style, and still kawaii, and pretty...seems to be a range from sweet to morbid... I guess...
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Unread 01-29-2004, 09:24 AM   #3
Cait
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First of all, its not called the "Gothic Lolita Bible," its called the, "Gothic & Lolita Bible." The two aren't necesiarily the same thing. In the domestic cosplay community, the term EGL is often thrown at the rock style simply because that's the only one people care to learn. As a matter of face, the Gothic & Lolita Bible features at least four different associated styles: Gothic, Lolita, Punk, and Fruits. Any of them can be combined, but there are certainly outfits that are elegant, mature, and dark that can only be classified as Gothic, and outfits that are pink, childlike, and frilly, that can be only classified as Lolita. It honestly sounds like you have a simply Lolita ensamble that has an unnecessary adjective or two added onto it. Its still as acceptable as an EGL, but the term doesn't really apply.
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Unread 01-29-2004, 10:11 AM   #4
Darkside Blues
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Personally I feel anything that's Victorian-esque (frilly, velvety, etc.) and in dark colors (especially black) is EGL. For my outfits, Gothic and Lolita are inseperable.
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Unread 01-29-2004, 11:16 AM   #5
Fireflystar
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Ok, I made the inital post about the dress not being EGL. The dress you posted that was $6 was something from the 80's in the style of Victiorian, but it just screamed 80's, the lace did not look anything like Victorian lace to me.
I'm sorry,blah,that dress...is...anyway! If you wanna call it EGL there needs to be modifications. Please don't tell me you were just going to wear it as it was.

And yes,there's a lot of different styles in the Gothic and Lolita Bibles..I guess since you've shoped on ebay you'd know about Fruits, hah, it just bothers me when Ebayers try to sell people things that are collecting dust in an old trash bag and they wanna call it Fruits cause it has stripes in it..or Gothic Lolita because it has lace on a dress. *
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Unread 01-29-2004, 11:31 AM   #6
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Unread 01-29-2004, 11:32 AM   #7
duck
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The way I see how it breaks down is...

Elegant = Victorian/classically inspired, conservative.
Gothic = dark and brooding colours...etc.
Lolita = Youthful, frilly. (little bo peep!)

So, the way I define it is if it is pink and victorianesque and childish looking - it's Elegant Lolita.

If it is dark and youthful but shows off a bit too much cleavage(which makes the lolita part questionable as well, I guess...), it's Gothic Lolita.

If it is a dark corset, a dark coloured chemise and a flowy skirt, it's Elegant Gothic ( with the Aristocrat appendage if deemed necessary).

But then, those are the definitions I hold for my own sake, I really don't care what people call what they wear.
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Unread 01-29-2004, 02:14 PM   #8
DeadLegato
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I forgot the and, myep. My bad! -_-*. I guess the dress in question is really more of a elegant lolita than an elegant GOTHIC lolita so to speak.

I found this article defining EGL, but it doesn't take into account any of the longer dresses, so it's not exactly complete: http://www.morbidoutlook.com/fashion...hiclolita.html but it's a start.

Fireflystar: Your comments were rude and uncalled for. You have a right not to like the dress, but there is a difference between constructive critisism (such as: I think it would be more EGL if you shortened it and changed the lace) and looking down your nose at someone else. If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all. Do onto others as you would have them do unto you. And yes, I wore the dress as is, because it's a 1970's (not 80's, I traced the original dress via the internet to the Gunne Sax clothing line and placed its production date.) vintage dress, and I didn't buy it through ebay. I found it at a vintage clothing store and bought it because it suggested lolita to me. It's okay for you to hate ebay people who misrepresent stuff, but it was no excuse for you to use the post as a sounding board for your own gripes.
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Unread 01-30-2004, 11:49 AM   #9
inertia
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For me, EGL is specifically Moi-meme-Moitie (or Moitie-style) Lolita clothing as seen on their OHP under "E.G.L.". Moitie is the brand that came up with that label to define their clothing. Since then it's been appropriated by English-speakers to mean "everything Lolita" but I can't agree with that...

Also, I do not think frills and lace make a garment Lolita. Lolita clothing has a distinctive shape which makes it Lolita whether it's trimmed with lace or not. It's like... frosting decorations might be the first thing that catch your eye on a birthday cake, but putting them on an apple pie isn't going to make it a cake. And in the same way, garments which have that distinctive Lolita silhouette will be Lolita even if there's not a bit of lace; while something with the wrong shape is NOT lolita no matter how much lace/frills/ribbons are piled on.
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Unread 01-30-2004, 12:32 PM   #10
Kaede
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Well ... since it's it's a fashion ... everyone's going to approach it differently. I suppose what makes things EGL is as Inertia said, the shape of the outfits. The skirts beginning higher on the waist and falling at or below the knees. But that's where people argue over the difference between EGL and EGA. EGA in my opinion is more accurate to Victorian wear, as in long black winter double-breasted coats and the like. More streamlined to your body, yet still hiding your body shape.
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Unread 01-30-2004, 02:20 PM   #11
Kirschwasser
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I love the EGL style. My favourite styles are the ones Baby The Stars Shine Bright, Victorian Maiden, and Metamorphose make. I only have one EGL. I made one myself just recently & it looks great~! (I based it off the Baby The Stars Shine Bright doll-like dresses). I'm happy with the results. I can't wait to get started on my original-designed EGL for Anime Expo. XD
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Unread 01-30-2004, 02:28 PM   #12
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Anything that looks like it could be in the Gothic and Lolita bible. I mean, its the BIBLE.

Honestly, anything that looks well put together thats gothic/doll-like.
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Unread 01-30-2004, 02:44 PM   #13
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ok let me begin(dun-dun-dunnnnnn) Ok there are a few catagories of gothic lolita, you can find them right here, http://www.frozen-spring.net/crosses/styles.html . That really sums it up ^.^, and like someone else said(sorry im to lazy to find out) there is also fruits, which is like bright colored crazy deisgned and what us Americans would call "mis matched" clothes. hope that helps, but yes, most things on ebay arent gothic lolita unless it is really from a japanese shop.
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Unread 01-30-2004, 02:49 PM   #14
panda ninja
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im sorry to be double posting but i just looked at your "gothic lolita" picture and i must say.......yeah, but first off you broke about 45794 gothic lolita rules, but let me point out a few things that really could make you look alot more gothic lolita, perhaps if you were to shorten the dress to knee length, do your hair (maybe in spirals or pig tales of some sort, because you have nice EGL hair) and to go with the dress some white leggings and white mary janes, and maybe even add in a head peice of sorts or white gloves ^.^, im anoying
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Unread 01-30-2004, 06:15 PM   #15
Fireflystar
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^ No you're just being truthful.

Legato, I happen to love the Lolita style more than probably any cosplay, so when you openly ask what people think is EGL, you're bound to get get people like me that find that the EGL dresses must follow a pattern or specific look.

It's just lazy to me that you'd buy a 70's dress and not make any modifications and wear it as is and make a thread about how beautiful it was. The title was like "LOOK and weep at this EGL dress" or something of that nature..and I just didn't understand what the huge deal was. I actually own a *real* Victorian dress, but you don't see me making a thread about how great and EGL it is.
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