Go Back   Cosplay.com > Cosplay Chat > General Cosplay Chat

Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Unread 04-02-2013, 09:03 AM   #46
Scorpion89
The Master
 
Scorpion89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 944
Quote:
Originally Posted by Misseeriechan View Post
ant[/size]



Now can people get back to the OP's topic at hand?
Sure as I did a few post back it's not the Cosplayer or Model who is giving the movement a bad name it's the Tog who is giving Cosplay Togs a bad name that is what the subject should be not the fact the OP may or may not think this type of photography is giving cosplay a bad name. As I have already pointed out many times in this thread that folks dressing in a cosplay outfit and then stripping does happen but by Pro Cosplayers for the most part(See Cosplay Burlesque).

The real issue is the Creep Guy With Camera issue that has become a real issue with-in both Cosplay and General Modeling Photography
__________________
Check out my photographs at,
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pby5a/
Scorpion89 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Unread 04-02-2013, 11:32 AM   #47
KuroNekoCosplay
Runnin' with wolves~
 
KuroNekoCosplay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Misseeriechan View Post
I agree with RydiaValentine (I think cosplay is getting put in as a key word just to make more money since we seem to be a fan base that spends a lot)

IMHO If you are gonna sell skin at least own up to it and don't call it by the name of a hobby that its verb form specifically means TO BE DRESSED UP AS (i.e."I'm gonna cosplay Ash")... not undressed, jeez people.
(some offenders worse than others; a wig and a grainy webcamshot of a butt in a thong is hardly cosplay and barely photography)

Someone referred to it as the 'fetish side of cosplay' and well... yeah, i don't support that being brought forward as the mainstream image of cosplay.

OP. You go girl. I applaud your standards and values.

Thanks
KuroNekoCosplay is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 11:34 AM   #48
KuroNekoCosplay
Runnin' with wolves~
 
KuroNekoCosplay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by PixiePopNixie View Post
You've not gotten the points people are making at all.

This isn't an argument/debate/whatever about cosplayers in skimpy cosplays. It's not about the fetish-esque costumes. The problem is sexualising/fetishing cosplayers, the people in the cosplay.

People are worried if magazines take a photo of a stripper who's in a Rikku costume (or part of one) with some sexualised caption, and then labeling it as "cosplay". Then, someone who sees that with go "Oh, cosplay is a sex thing". Cosplayers will then be exactly the same as "Furries".

Personally, I have a bit of an issue with the labelling of it. I don't like the idea of people (or men) seeing a girl in cosplay and think "oh, she's fair game" or "She wants the D" or whatever. Women will see it as "oh, they're just pathetic sl*ts".

However, whilst there are magazines that have and will post barely covered females and file them under the same thing as something else, it is still a completely different hobby (i
f that can be counted as a hobby - more of a profession, really). Yes, there will be sexualised images of people with the tag "cosplay", but there is also media coverage about what it really is - in the UK, the BBC does a fair amount of coverage about London Expo, an Exposition which attracts over 40,000 people, a fair amount of them cosplayers. There are blogs and websites devoted to actual cosplay, and it's quite easy to see it's not some sex filled fetish.

There will always be a dark side to something like this. It's got grown women in bras and short shorts, for crying out loud, and others dressed as school girls. People have been cashing in on that for years.

This is exactly what I was trying to say, and I agree. Like I said, I wear a catsuit, there's nothing wrong with skinny cosplays and such, but to just outright make it porn? ugh.
KuroNekoCosplay is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 12:34 PM   #49
TheFontBandit
Trial-&-Error Champion
 
TheFontBandit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by LluviaSarcasm View Post
I doubt that it will happen, but I still think not wanting to be unfairly judged is a legit concern.
(A quick note: All of the instances of "you" here are meant as a general, vague "you", not a direct response to anyone. I'm just citing the post above as a starting point for the part of the discussion I'm addressing).

I don't understand the big hoopla over "but other people will think ____". You can't really ever control what other people think, and you shouldn't be able to. What you can do is represent yourself and your cosplay in a way that is honest to your own personality. If you never wear skimpy costumes, most people aren't going to associate you with those who do. Kind of like how if you never wear a Legend of Zelda cosplay, most people aren't going to just assume you're a LoZ fan.

And some people are always going to unfairly judge you about something, period. Maybe some of your luggage got lost at the airport and you're forced to wear your costume without the right shoes. Someone is going to look at you and assume you're "just a lazy cosplayer". Maybe you made some alterations to make the costume more flattering for your body, and other cosplayers are going to judge you for being inaccurate. Or your cosplay could just be from a show someone hates, and they'll look down on you for that. There are people out there who will judge you (and your cosplay) based on your age, your weight, your race, your gender. There are hateful and judgmental people in this world, and you shouldn't let them decide whether you participate in a hobby you enjoy.

So yes, there are probably some people who don't know anything about cosplay and might jump to random conclusions... do you really care that much about what some random judgmental stranger thinks of you?

On the subject of staying on-topic, all of these topics are integrated. Cosplayers looking at "sexy" genderbent crossplays and calling those costumers "sluts" is engendering the same kind of judgment from within the community that this thread claims to want to avoid from those outside the community. How can you pass judgment on a fellow cosplayer and call them derogatory names, then claim that you don't want other people to call you names? The snap-judgment of "cosplayers are all sluts" already exists in some people's eyes, because of the level of judgment heaped on the community by the public and other cosplayers. When people in the hobby are demeaning and slut-shaming women in revealing costumes, we are sending a message to people outside the hobby that it is okay to call these women "sluts" and other derogatory names based solely on their clothing. We're basically saying "it's okay to look at a costume and make blanket assumptions, judgments, and cruel public statements about this person. We do the same thing."

The issue of slut-shaming is a major one, and it's incredibly rampant in this hobby. I'll admit, sometimes I see costumes that make me inwardly cringe because they're way past my own comfort level. But that doesn't mean I have the right to post a photo and say "OMG what was this person thinking?" I just move on and let that person do their thing, as is their right. Everyone has their own level of comfort with costume skimpiness, but it's not your place to tell others what their level should be or what they can and cannot wear. The cosplay world would be a much more pleasant place if we all stopped worrying so much about what everyone else is wearing.

It IS, however, the right of the OP to say to that photographer, "That's not my thing. It makes me uncomfortable and I don't want to participate in this project", and they should not be shamed for that either.

On the topic of public opinion, one photographer really isn't going to tip the scale of public opinion all that much. There already is "Cosplay Porn" and "Cosplay Erotica". Cosplay Deviants was linked early on in the thread. Most of the conversation in this thread is responding as if this is a new thing. It exists, and it always will exist. There are porn versions of everything, and cosplay is just an extension of that. Just because there are a few cosplay porn companies out there, I doubt many people are immediately going to make the leap to say "anyone who wears a costume must be a stripper or porn star". When you Google "Cosplay", the first page that pops up is Wikipedia's entry on Cosplay, but the second is this very site. Cosplay has gotten big enough and "mainstream" enough that the public opinion of cosplay is kind of already set.

If someone finds out I cosplay and immediately thinks "you must be a porn star", I don't really care. It's either someone who will look further and find out that's not my thing, or I don't care much what their opinion is. And if it was my thing, that would be fine too. Live and let live.
__________________
My Cosplay Adventures on Tumblr

Dragon*Con 2013:
Joyleaf - Elfquest || Belial/Mad Hatter - Angel Sanctuary
Surprise Hulk Variant - Marvel Comics || Black Widow - Hawkeye #9 || Mary Jane Watson - J. Scott Campbell version
Maevaris Tilani - Dragon Age Comics || Sugar Rush Racer Sticky Wipplesnit - Wreck-It Ralph

Last edited by TheFontBandit : 04-02-2013 at 01:05 PM.
TheFontBandit is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 01:30 PM   #50
cuda
Registered User
 
cuda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorpion89 View Post
Sure as I did a few post back it's not the Cosplayer or Model who is giving the movement a bad name it's the Tog who is giving Cosplay Togs a bad name that is what the subject should be not the fact the OP may or may not think this type of photography is giving cosplay a bad name. As I have already pointed out many times in this thread that folks dressing in a cosplay outfit and then stripping does happen but by Pro Cosplayers for the most part(See Cosplay Burlesque).

The real issue is the Creep Guy With Camera issue that has become a real issue with-in both Cosplay and General Modeling Photography
I don't have a big problem with a cosplayer who want to partake in show off their bodies, and I'm not throwing the photographers under the bus for take pictures of the cosplayers that are welling to take revealing photo.

What I do have a problem is with people how are take a "cute costume" and have no Idea who or what that character is and then turn around and saying their a cosplayer. I am going to hold my ground on that opinion because it don't follow the definition of cosplay which is "the art or practice of wearing costumes to portray characters from fiction, especially from manga, animation, and science fiction."-Dictionary.com-

As far as photographer if you can't find a cosplayer to take picture of, don't go half-ass on your project and hire someone to wear a random costume, than claim it as cosplay. here the some of the reason why:

* Mislabeling. It's like take a whopper form Burger king and placing into a McDonald box and calling it a big mac. It may look like the same thing but it two different burgers.

* The real deal is better. Cosplayer have an eye for detail, They know what the characters ability, attitude and mind set is. You can't get that kind of detail and emotion of someone who is just wearing some random costume.
cuda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 01:49 PM   #51
Oniigiri_Basket
Fangirl Extraordinaire
 
Oniigiri_Basket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,351
Cosplay

Costume-play

Costume


There you have it.
__________________
ACen 2014 cosplay: Lara Croft, Erio Touwa, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
Otakon 2014 cosplay: Makise Kurisu, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
ALA 2015 cosplay: Shirahoshi Hime, Akemi Homura [Haregi ver.], Mayoi Hachikuji
Possible 2015 conventions: Sakura-con, A-Kon
https://www.facebook.com/riceballcosplay
Oniigiri_Basket is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 02:33 PM   #52
cuda
Registered User
 
cuda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oniigiri_Basket View Post
Cosplay

Costume-play

Costume


There you have it.
Thank you for raining on my parade! lol

But you need to add the play to make it cosplay!
cuda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 03:40 PM   #53
Oniigiri_Basket
Fangirl Extraordinaire
 
Oniigiri_Basket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,351
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuda View Post
Thank you for raining on my parade! lol

But you need to add the play to make it cosplay!
Well, the "play" part is acting in character, which not everyone does and I can't think of a person who would say that it's necessary.
__________________
ACen 2014 cosplay: Lara Croft, Erio Touwa, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
Otakon 2014 cosplay: Makise Kurisu, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
ALA 2015 cosplay: Shirahoshi Hime, Akemi Homura [Haregi ver.], Mayoi Hachikuji
Possible 2015 conventions: Sakura-con, A-Kon
https://www.facebook.com/riceballcosplay
Oniigiri_Basket is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 04:43 PM   #54
Septembre
That charming devil again
 
Septembre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 78
So, this guy wants to do pornographic themed cosplays to make cosplay look bad...? Not because hes a sick perverted bastard that wants to do nothing more than advocate the degredation of women through pornography?

I don't know about cosplay having a bad reputation. Whoever looks at cosplayers and have those pre-formulated notions are ignorant, probably have less than interesting lives and can eat a bag of dicks.

I think nudity is an art. If the photography is based on the beauty of the natural naked body then I think I'd be alright with it. Anything more graphic than that is kind of ruining cosplay for me, although I do like porn a lot. It's kinda like mixing peanut butter with sushi. Love both, but that shit just doesn't mix.
__________________

Cosplay List

Shin Megami Tensei
SMT: Imagine - IGC `Razgriz - Completed (October 2011)
SMT: Persona 4 - Yu Narukami - Completed (May 2013)
SMT: Persona 3 - Akihiko Sanada - TBA (0%)

Death Note
Kira - Light Yagami TBA (0%)
Matt - TBA (0%)

RWBY
Adam - TBA (0%)

Naruto
Zabuza - TBA (0%)

Secret Cosplay - TBA (0%)

Also doing future cosplays for Final Fantasy, Devil May Cry, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare, Metal Gear Solid and more!
Always looking for cosplay partners & groups!

Septembre is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 04:48 PM   #55
Septembre
That charming devil again
 
Septembre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuda View Post
I don't have a big problem with a cosplayer who want to partake in show off their bodies, and I'm not throwing the photographers under the bus for take pictures of the cosplayers that are welling to take revealing photo.

What I do have a problem is with people how are take a "cute costume" and have no Idea who or what that character is and then turn around and saying their a cosplayer. I am going to hold my ground on that opinion because it don't follow the definition of cosplay which is "the art or practice of wearing costumes to portray characters from fiction, especially from manga, animation, and science fiction."-Dictionary.com-

As far as photographer if you can't find a cosplayer to take picture of, don't go half-ass on your project and hire someone to wear a random costume, than claim it as cosplay. here the some of the reason why:

* Mislabeling. It's like take a whopper form Burger king and placing into a McDonald box and calling it a big mac. It may look like the same thing but it two different burgers.

* The real deal is better. Cosplayer have an eye for detail, They know what the characters ability, attitude and mind set is. You can't get that kind of detail and emotion of someone who is just wearing some random costume.
Agree, agree and agree
__________________

Cosplay List

Shin Megami Tensei
SMT: Imagine - IGC `Razgriz - Completed (October 2011)
SMT: Persona 4 - Yu Narukami - Completed (May 2013)
SMT: Persona 3 - Akihiko Sanada - TBA (0%)

Death Note
Kira - Light Yagami TBA (0%)
Matt - TBA (0%)

RWBY
Adam - TBA (0%)

Naruto
Zabuza - TBA (0%)

Secret Cosplay - TBA (0%)

Also doing future cosplays for Final Fantasy, Devil May Cry, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare, Metal Gear Solid and more!
Always looking for cosplay partners & groups!

Septembre is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 05:19 PM   #56
cuda
Registered User
 
cuda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oniigiri_Basket View Post
Well, the "play" part is acting in character, which not everyone does and I can't think of a person who would say that it's necessary.
not quite, I think people should have some knowledge of the character, also some of the best cosplayer I've seen acted like their character. on the other hand, people can decide on how much effort they want to put into acting. I will not down grade people for not acting, but I find that if they put effort into act like their characters, then they are allot funner to watch and it add more to their cosplay.

I see it like this, if they can't act, say anything related to what the character or at lease tell me something about that character, then I think their real not cosplaying. but, that just my thoughts on cosplay.
cuda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 05:39 PM   #57
Lithium Flower
Handphones
 
Lithium Flower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 15,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuda View Post
What I do have a problem is with people how are take a "cute costume" and have no Idea who or what that character is and then turn around and saying their a cosplayer. I am going to hold my ground on that opinion because it don't follow the definition of cosplay which is "the art or practice of wearing costumes to portray characters from fiction, especially from manga, animation, and science fiction."-Dictionary.com-
Are you 5 fucking years old?
Do you need people to carry an 'official cosplayer card' so you can rest assured none of those 'fakes' are getting all up in your favorite cartoon? Are we going to start fingerprinting all the 'legit' cosplayers and making a big database of people who look at a character design and say "I like this but don't know who they are" so we can make sure they don't invade the precious sanctity of wearing spandex booty shorts in public?

Tell me how amazing and super great you are because you can name every character on Battlestar Galactica and someone else just liked the costume.

Dictionary.com isn't going to conventions and spending money on costumes.




When can we just murder this stupid nonsensical bullshit idea of 'real' versus 'fake' cosplayers? Because it needs to go die in a fire pit.
__________________
Iíll tell you what people look like, really: they look like flames. Or like the stars, on a clear night in the wilderness.
LiveStream
Emmers Drawberry: Professional Superhero
◆○◆○◆○◆○◆○
Tumblr silliness.

◆○◆○◆○◆○◆○
Deviantart of more super silliness

Lithium Flower is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 06:03 PM   #58
Scorpion89
The Master
 
Scorpion89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 944
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lithium Flower View Post
Are you 5 fucking years old?
Do you need people to carry an 'official cosplayer card' so you can rest assured none of those 'fakes' are getting all up in your favorite cartoon? Are we going to start fingerprinting all the 'legit' cosplayers and making a big database of people who look at a character design and say "I like this but don't know who they are" so we can make sure they don't invade the precious sanctity of wearing spandex booty shorts in public?

Tell me how amazing and super great you are because you can name every character on Battlestar Galactica and someone else just liked the costume.

Dictionary.com isn't going to conventions and spending money on costumes.




When can we just murder this stupid nonsensical bullshit idea of 'real' versus 'fake' cosplayers? Because it needs to go die in a fire pit.
So tell us how your really feel I mean don't hold back anything
__________________
Check out my photographs at,
http://www.flickr.com/photos/pby5a/
Scorpion89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 06:43 PM   #59
emmisu
King of Toast
 
emmisu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lithium Flower View Post
When can we just murder this stupid nonsensical bullshit idea of 'real' versus 'fake' cosplayers? Because it needs to go die in a fire pit.
This, so much this.
You don't wanna cosplay out of your fandom? Then don't.
But don't push your personal standards on the rest of the world, there is now law in Cosplay.
Costume play: play, have fun. In costume.

Pornography is an art in and of itself. And if you don't want to look at cosplay porn, don't.
If you feel the need to police public opinion, you're an ass. That's basically it.

There's literally porn of everything. Japan has a HUGE database of cosplay themed porn videos and images, so I guess you don't think they're 'real' cosplayers either. Then you probably don't think 'cosplay idols' in japan are 'real' cosplayers.

The reason I get steamed about the use of the phrase 'giving it a bad name' is because YOU are the one deciding that being in pornography is bad or degrading and an assumption you don't want people to have of you. That's fine for you personally. But the problem is that you're blanketing being in porn as a negative thing, and therefore making a statement that being a pornstar or sex worker or slut is a BAD thing.

That is more harmful to women than using them as masturbatory material. You are saying that women must not have self-respect if they're slutty or in porn. you're saying that all sex work is forced, not a choice. You're saying that posing nude makes them somehow lower than you on the social food chain.
It's part of a huge problem in society where 'sex is bad' or 'showing skin is a no-no' or 'she was dressed slutty so she was asking for it'. This is why I have a HUGE problem with this thread.

I don't find being a porn star to be a negative thing. If someone assumed I was, well they would have a hell of a time finding me in any porn but they can have their opinion.
You're dressing up like a goddamned cartoon character, I think you can get off your high horse for five seconds.

I swear.
__________________
Bronycon 2014
Otakon 2014

Plans:
Cerise Hood (EAH)
emmisu is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 04-02-2013, 08:40 PM   #60
Oniigiri_Basket
Fangirl Extraordinaire
 
Oniigiri_Basket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,351
Lithium, you's my girl.
__________________
ACen 2014 cosplay: Lara Croft, Erio Touwa, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
Otakon 2014 cosplay: Makise Kurisu, Shirahoshi Hime, Sengoku Nadeko
ALA 2015 cosplay: Shirahoshi Hime, Akemi Homura [Haregi ver.], Mayoi Hachikuji
Possible 2015 conventions: Sakura-con, A-Kon
https://www.facebook.com/riceballcosplay
Oniigiri_Basket is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:36 AM.


Copyright 2002-2013 Cosplay.com, LLC. All Rights Reserved.
All comments and posts in our forums are the opinion of the respective poster.